Am I Demisexual? | Transcript
Find the episode shownotes here!
Hannah Witton
Hello and welcome to Doing It, the sex curious show where we ask questions and nerd out and explore the weird and wonderful world of sexuality and relationships. I'm your host, Hannah Witton, resident sex nerd and sex ed enthusiast. We are currently working on some very exciting changes for Season Five of Doing It but we didn't want to leave you hanging so here's what's going to happen. We asked you to email us questions for things you need advice with, and myself and my assistant Megan, who you may remember from a previous episode, are going to attempt to answer them. Quick disclaimer though: we are not doctors or therapists. The advice we give is purely what we imagine we would say to a friend if they came to us with these questions. It's that kind of vibe of agony aunting. Either we're down at the pub having a chat, or at a sleepover, a dinner party, or having a really long phone call and getting deep. Each week in the lead up to season five launching we'll be answering one question with new episodes every Wednesday as usual. If you want to share your thoughts, insights, and advice on the dilemmas, then please do join in the conversation over on social media. We are @doingitpodcast on Instagram and Twitter. Links to everything we talk about in the shownotes on our website as usual. And I hope you enjoy this series of agony aunt style minisodes.
All right, what have we got today?
Megan Moore
Okay, so today, we have a question about demisexuality. So this is bit of a longer letter to the agony aunts.
Hannah Witton
I love it. I'm ready.
Megan Moore
But it's all context. It's all good. It's all good. Okay, so this is from Hadas, I think I'm saying - there's a pronunciation guide, I'm sorry if I did not get that right. So: at 25 years old, I don't have any romantic or sexual experience to speak of, and I think I might be demisexual.
Hannah Witton
Ooh.
Megan Moore
How do I explore my presumed demisexuality? How do I know it's not some deep engraved anti-comphet I want to be queer mind games? How do I find my label without sexual or romantic experience to serve as a database? Okay, so she goes on: my sexual experience amounts to one kiss, and a bad one at that at 17. And a bunch of okayish masturbation sessions in which I'm quite sure I've yet to orgasm. In terms of romantic relationships, I've never had those either, and not due to lack of trying. When I've seriously caught feelings to someone, I put myself out there and let them know. That happened at age 11, 18, and 22. All of those ended in rejections, some much more painful than the others. But lockdown brain spirals, your podcast, and other sexuality content online made me see a very clear pattern. These three men had one thing in common: I've been their very good friend for at the very least a few weeks before I caught on to having feelings. It made me wonder, might I be demisexual? Most of what I read about it seems to click, the pattern fits, and it'll explain why I find myself so detached from my online dating attempts or why my only serious celebrity crushes has been on actors I've got to know the personality of through many interviews. I also consume most of my porn in the shape of smut reader-insert fanfics because I already have a bond to the character after years of being invested in their story and it's that much more rousing. Thanks for even just giving me the excuse to put those thoughts into words. So the question: how do I know it's not some deep engraved anti-comphet I want to be queer mind games? How do I find my label without sexual or romantic experience to serve as a database?
Hannah Witton
Oof, oh my goodness.
Megan Moore
I know, right?
Hannah Witton
I want to give them a big hug.
Megan Moore
I know if you - if you like hugs -
Hannah Witton
Yeah.
Megan Moore
- here. There are two, there are two coming your way.
Hannah Witton
Okay, so my first, like, follow up questions, because the questions always breed more questions.
Megan Moore
They do, they do.
Hannah Witton
Is the bit where she said that she'd been these guys' friends for a few weeks before she caught on to having feelings. But I'm like, is that crush feelings or sexual feelings?
Megan Moore
That's a good question.
Hannah Witton
Because that is something that I hard relate to, of like, actually, like getting to know someone or just like being in someone's presence, and then like, after a while, suddenly you look at them different, you're like, hang on a second. Wait, wait a minute. But sometimes for me, it's, oh, hello, I now think of you as sexually viable, or it might be a ooh, I now think of you as like somebody who I'm romantically interested in and I want to kind of pursue that and sometimes it's both at the same time. So that would be something that maybe ask yourself, like when you've had that, like catching feelings, what kind of feelings were they?
Megan Moore
So it's interesting that you say that like after you've got to know someone you, like, start - you can feel differently about them because that is not the case for me.
Hannah Witton
Ooh. Well I - for me, it's like all of the things like I could meet someone and instantly be attracted Yeah. To them without knowing them at all. Or in other cases, it might be someone I've known for ages. And then suddenly I'm like, hang on, how am I - why am I looking at you differently now? This is strange.
Megan Moore
Yeah, no, that I think that's happened. I think that's happened to me. But like, generally much more I get like a - I guess like, after I know someone for a long time, it gets a - I guess - that's more of a like, romance - that's when like the romantic feelings could happen. But the like sexual am i into you? Yes or no? Happens like, I'm just looking at a person.
Hannah Witton
Yeah. Sometimes I find - oh, okay, this is not about me.
Megan Moore
Sorry, this is about other people. This is not about us.
Hannah Witton
But I was suddenly was just like, for some people, I'm instantly sexually attracted to them. But for some other people, that - I - it has to be through a process of getting to know them and then suddenly, I'm like, ooh, now I find you sexually attractive when I didn't before. But yeah, I don't know. That's a - that's a side note. More to explore on that, Hannah. So do we want to give like a definition of demisexuality? Do you have a good one? Your wife is demisexual, is that...?
Megan Moore
My wife is demisexual. So you think that I would have a great definition off the top of my head. Um, but so as far as I understand it, being demisexual means that you don't develop sexual feelings for someone until you know them. However much that is.
Hannah Witton
Like a developed emotional connection.
Megan Moore
Yeah, a developed - when you've got an emotional connection with someone, that's when you might develop sexual feelings. You don't it never goes the other way round. Or like it can go the other way around sometimes, because no sexuality is black and white, necessarily. But as an overarching pattern, you need to have - it's like, if you went into a bar, and your friend was like, go hit on that person. You'd be like, why when I'm not into them? But say if you were - if you went into a bar and you met someone and you made friends with them, and then you hung out for a few months, and then then you could be like, oh, wait, I think, I think I have the sexy feelings about you.
Hannah Witton
Yeah, yeah.
Megan Moore
The best - I like, I have permission from Lal to tell the story. But my, my favourite thing about her being demi - like, obviously her sexuality is her sexuality, but like my favourite thing is that she sort of... not discovered but like, came up against it in a more real way when we were just scrolling Tumblr. And there was this post that was like, I'm ace. And like, what is it like for you like allosexuals? Are you just walking down the street and you see someone and you don't know anyone about them and you're like, Yeah, I'd bang that?
Hannah Witton
Yeah.
Megan Moore
And I was like - Lal was like, pfft, no. And I was like, uh, yes. And then we both looked at each other like.... huh.
Hannah Witton
There we go. That's the - there's the difference.
Megan Moore
So that's basically how I think of - I mean, that's, that was a post about someone who is ace not someone who is demi, but that's what sort of opened the door there.
Hannah Witton
But if Lal saw you walking down the street...
Megan Moore
Yeah, like me, her hot hot wife that she is very much in love with, she'd be like, yeah.
Hannah Witton
Yes, exactly. I think it's really interesting. This kind of like, conflict that this person has also about, like, is it comphet?
Megan Moore
Yeah. I think honestly, like, welcome to the LGBTQ+ spectrum. Like one of your tick marks for entry is like, do you think you're making it up?
Hannah Witton
Aw, yeah. Like, is this even real?
Megan Moore
Yeah, I think like, I had someone say - I think it was in Red, White and Royal Blue, but other people said it, I'm sure - it's like, straight people do not spend time wondering if they are straight. Like they are - they just go about being straight. And like I as an allo person have never spent any time being like, am I -
Hannah Witton
I wonder if I'm sexual. I wonder if I experience sexual attraction.
Megan Moore
Right, like, I've only considered it when someone has pointed out - like when Lal has been talking about it or like you see stuff online. I'm like, huh, that's not how I feel, and then I just go on about my life. I don't then spend, say, the next few weeks or months being like, this has like resonated within me and like I can't get it out of my head.
Hannah Witton
Mmhm. Yeah, I would recommend like finding like demisexual people on YouTube or like on TikTok or online and stuff, who are talking about their experiences, and kind of like, seeing if you relate to any of it. Like, obviously, everyone's experience will be different. I recently watched this video from Evie lupine, who is - she's asexual, and she has this amazing YouTube channel where she kind of talks about like kink and BDSM and everything. But she recently actually made a video about demisexuality. And she kind of had this list of questions to ask yourself, to help explore. And I'm just going to read them out now but I'll also link her video in the shownotes. But the questions that she asked were:
Do you find the people you have close connections with to be aesthetically attractive, even if you don't want to have sex with them right away? Do you have sudden moments or experiences in your relationships where beforehand you did not experience sexual attraction but then after them you do? Do you choose to hold off on sex on purpose, even when you have the urge to do so? Or is it that you don't have that urge at all until that relationship or connection is more developed? Do you feel unable to connect with people in a physical sexual way until you have a deeper bond with them even if you might be okay with non-sexual intimate touch? That's kind of like cuddling and holding hands. Do you find the concept of celebrity crushes kind of weird and hard to understand? Or if you do have celebrity crushes, is it more focused on having a more deep, intimate emotional relationship with them rather than sexual upfront? And do the people you get into relationships with have more in common physically or emotionally in terms of their personality and hobbies and interests and things?
Obviously, that's not like a finite list of like, this is the quiz you have to take!
Megan Moore
You got 8 of 10 on BuzzFeed, so no, sorry, not for you.
Hannah Witton
You are demisexual, confirmed.
Hannah Witton
But yeah, I would recommend that video. And then also in that video, Evie recommended this video by someone who is demisexual and a lesbian talking about like, how do I know that I'm demisexual? I haven't had a chance to watch it yet but like, just go down the demisexual YouTube rabbit hole, basically.
Megan Moore
Confetti!
Megan Moore
Yeah. And there's one on - speaking of BuzzFeed - Ladylike, I think the videos are all still up from Ladylike, and it was Chantelle talking about her sexuality journey. And that was the first time that I'd seen someone that wasn't - that was like, a like personality rather than someone that I knew in my life, talking about it. And I think for Lal it was the first time she'd seen someone like - like representation out there. So I would go find that also. I'll see if I can find it and I'll pop it in the shownotes.
Hannah Witton
Great. Also, I think it's important to add that you don't have to like figure it out right now.
Megan Moore
Yeah! It's totally not like, you don't have to be like, oh, I've found my identity in one day. And that's it forever. Like, that's not how it works.
Hannah Witton
Yeah.
Megan Moore
Like, you can - you can feel one thing, you can feel differently tomorrow and that's okay, it doesn't invalidate what you felt yesterday. Or even like, you can be like, this is how I'm feeling right now. I don't know if there's a label for me, I'll find it. But like labels work for you. You don't need to fit a label.
Hannah Witton
Mm.
Megan Moore
Labels are like a tool for you to use to be like, here is this weird wibbly feeling inside of me that I'm trying to express to other people. And here is a word that we have decided means roughly that. I'm using it to communicate this to you. Like you're not like - there is no quiz. There is no, like, check mark quiz. It's fine.
Hannah Witton
Yeah, and I also think, like, I understand that figuring this stuff out and not really knowing and trying to, like, just understand your experience can be quite like anxiety inducing and quite stressful.
Megan Moore
Oh yeah, for sure.
Hannah Witton
But I also think that there is a huge amount of value of approaching it with just this kind of like, exploratory curious mind, where you're just kind of going in like, okay, how do I feel and let's - or, and also approaching that like in this non judgmental way. So you're just kind of like, okay, this is what's happening. This is what I'm feeling right now. This thing resonated with me. This thing doesn't resonate with me. And instead of, kind of going in, with, like, expectations, or an agenda of like, I must figure out what my sexual attraction is, just kind of like, let it all just like bubble up around you like, kind of like, look at it, explore it, taste it, touch it. And yeah, kind of have that kind of like curious mind about it. And try and - I guess it's fun exploring these things but society and comphet and like - what's the what's the kind of like comphet version of like allosexual being dominant?
Megan Moore
I guess compallo? Compulsory allosexuality?
Hannah Witton
Yeah, I don't know. Compulsory allosexuality. But that also like messes with us!
Megan Moore
And like, I obviously did not go through this but I like was there while Lal was exploring this, like my wife was exploring this, and she said that what really helped her was like doing the research, like looking into other people who were demi or on the allo - the asexuality spectrum, just have - like listening to their experiences, but then also talking to people who aren't, who are allo and being like, where do you diverge from that?
Hannah Witton
Mmm!
Megan Moore
Like, if they are saying, I always feel like this. This is how it goes. And you're like, mm, no, like, that's also a really interesting way to find out like, where your feelings are. And yeah, it's not like - it's not a test, you're not going in being like, I have to find out all the information about myself and there's a yes/no answer, and I can get it wrong and I could misunderstand myself like, no. No, no. This is more of a like Pinterest board for your feelings.
Hannah Witton
Oh my god, I love it. Yes, let's all create a Pinterest board of our sexualities this,
Megan Moore
Right? Like this, this fits. And I don't like that, so I won't save it. You're just like, you're just you're going in, you're having fun, you're just finding the stuff you like. And then you're keeping that for your own information. Find your own sexuality Pinterest.
Hannah Witton
Oh my god, this is going to be my new project. All right. I hope this helps!
Megan Moore
Also there are like, tonnes and tonnes and tonnes of metaphors like even if - so on the point of like, how do I do it with no data? Like, that's fine. But also sexuality isn't dependent on who you have or haven't slept with. Like, that's not -
Hannah Witton
Yeah.
Megan Moore
People will tell you that's the thing. But those people are wrong and biased.
Hannah Witton
For some people experiences can help you figure things out.
Megan Moore
Yeah.
Hannah Witton
And for other people, they don't need to at all. And for some people, it's a mixture of it all.
Megan Moore
Exactly, like experiences are part of your Pinterest board. They're not like the defining feature. But there are one bajillion metaphors out there for every kind of sexuality. But like, if you're having trouble sort of pinning down how it feels keep going through metaphors. Again, like... other people sexuality seems to be that, like, they want to hang their coat up, and there's always a hook on the wall. But if I go to hang my coat up, that just falls off because there's no hook. And like, but If I've lived in the house for a bit, I put a hook up and then I can hang my coat.
Hannah Witton
Ooh!
Megan Moore
Like, like that. But like just keep fumbling like - sometimes thinking about it - I don't know if this is just everyone, if this is everyone if it's just me - but finding the metaphor sometimes really helps. And you're saying, they're saying that they, that she reads - that her celebrity crushes or like actors that she feels connected to because she knows more about them and that she reads lots of fanfiction. My also my other tip would be find fanfiction where the characters that you like, are demi.
Hannah Witton
Ooh, yeah, I'm sure that exists out there.
Megan Moore
It does. The AO3 has everything. And then read that because then you're having the connection with the person, you already have the connection with the character or the actor or whoever it is, but they're sort of expressing something that you're trying to express and you can see how much of that feels good feels right.
Hannah Witton
Oh my god, I can't wait for us all to go away and create our sexuality Pinterest boards.
Megan Moore
I want one. I want one right now.
Hannah Witton
Thank you so much for listening. If you like the podcast, please don't forget to leave a rating and a review. It really helps us out and make sure to follow us on social media at @doingitpodcast to join in the conversation and keep up to date on everything happening with the podcast. Until next time!