Periods, Contraception and Hormones Roundtable | Transcript
Find the episode shownotes here!
Hannah Witton
Welcome to Doing It with me, Hannah Witton, where we talk all things sex, relationships, dating, and our bodies.
Hey everyone, welcome back to Doing It. So earlier in the year, I released my second book called The Hormone Diaries: The Bloody Truth about our Periods. And to celebrate that, I did a roundtable discussion on my YouTube channel, all about periods, contraception, and hormones, and health, and just all of that good stuff. And so I wanted to share the audio from that roundtable discussion here on the podcast. If you do want to see the video version, that's over on my YouTube channel, but here you can just get it in your lovely podcasting ears.
Hannah Witton
So I'm joined by Gabby Edlin, the founder and CEO of Bloody Good Period, Katie Beales, who runs the Instagram My Endometriosis Story, and A Peschanski, who is a queer documentary filmmaker. We talked all about periods, endometriosis, going on contraception for the first time, tracking your period, fertility awareness, discharge, dysphoria, and so many other topics. So thank you so much for listening, and thank you so much, again, to my contributors for having this amazing discussion with me on these topics. I just love talking about these things, hence why I wrote a whole goddamn book about them.
Next week is the final episode of season one of Doing It, but don't worry, there will still be minisodes coming out, next week is the last interview style episode. Thanks so much again for listening, and I hope you enjoy this discussion. Thank you all for joining me. I'm really excited.
We've got Gabby, A and Katie. Gabby is the founder and CEO of Bloody Good Period, a charitable project, campaigning for menstrual equity. Did I get that right?
Gabby Edlin
That's right, you did!
Hannah Witton
Yay! A is an LGBT documentary maker and podcaster. And Katie is an endometriosis activist. And thank you all for spending this time with me. So we'll just dive in. What was your first period like? How did that happen, do you have a good story? Or a terrible story?
Gabby Edlin
Mine's about Creme Eggs.
Hannah Witton
Okay, curious.
Gabby Edlin
So, I feel like I've told you this one before actually. You're gonna hear it again, anyway. There were no Creme Eggs harmed, well, no that's actually not true. So that's not true at all because I ate three, I ate three when I was 13, one night, a Friday night, I had three Creme Eggs and I just had the worst stomach pains, and my mum said, "it's because you've had three Creme Eggs.” And you know when you know? There is a different pain, and I was like -
Hannah Witton
It's like it's not here, it's here.
Gabby Edlin
"It's lower, mother." and Creme Eggs don't go down that low. I would say it's definitely not, it's something else. Anyway, woke up the next morning, first period. And I was delighted.
Hannah Witton
Oh, how old were you?
Gabby Edlin
I was 13 and I was absolutely gagging to start. Like, oh my God, it was all we talked about at school and you know, and it was like a really like - it was like really little brown stain, oo we're getting in there straight away.
Hannah Witton
Oh, yeah, no absolutely.
Gabby Edlin
It was really little, like it wasn't like this big gush that I'd expected. So. But that was it, and that was like, you know, a big relief for me because it was all I thought about.
Hannah Witton
Oh really.
Gabby Edlin
It was really like, that was me becoming you know, grown up.
Hannah Witton
Yeah, that's so interesting, because I started when I was 11, and I remember only telling my mum, and like not telling any of my friends because we weren't quite at that age where we talked about it.
Gabby Edlin
You must have been one of the first as well.
Hannah Witton
First to get tits, first to bleed, all of it.
Gabby Edlin
So mine didn't come until I was 17.
Hannah Witton
What about you?
Katie Beales
Quite similar.
Hannah Witton
Yeah.
Katie Beales
I was dreaming about having my period. I just wanted my period. All my friends had it. And yeah, I wanted to feel like a woman. And then when I finally got it, I was 14, and when I said to my mum, I was like, "Oh mum, I started my period." She was like, "No, Katie, you're far too skinny to have your period." I don't know, there's this feeling that, like, you have to be a certain weight to have a period.
Hannah Witton
If you're underweight like your periods could stop or it might actually stop you from starting your period.
Katie Beales
It might be that. And I was just like, "Mum, I'm pretty sure I've started my period."
Hannah Witton
Pretty sure that's what it is!
Katie Beales
She was like, "I don't think you have, darling." Okay.
Hannah Witton
I'll prove it to you!
Katie Beales
So I went off to bed. I was like, I don't know if I actually thought, like maybe I just cut myself. And then I woke up in the morning, and I'd started my period. And I just ran into my mum's room, like, "Mum, look, see I have stated my period!"
Gabby Edlin
You were vindicated.
Katie Beales
And then she felt really guilty. Yeah, that that was when it all started
Hannah Witton
The mothers are just in denial.
Katie Beales
Yeah.
Gabby Edlin
I think that is a big part of it.
Hannah Witton
They're like, my baby can't grow up.
Gabby Edlin
Yeah, like there's no going back now.
Hannah Witton
Yeah, that's it. What about you, A?
A Peschanski
Oh, well, I've always, always been the youngest in my class. And so my best friend had been like talking about getting her period for a year. Like, we'd run out of class because she was like, "Oh, my God, that's it, that's my period." Like, literally, every couple hours.
Gabby Edlin
It was just discharge.
A Peschanski
It was nothing. Everytime, it was nothing. And this one day, I was just like, going home after school, and then I was like, "Oo er, what, what is that? Oooo, that feels, I wonder what's happening to me." And then I kind of went home, and I was like, "Oh, that's my period." And then I texted this friend, and I was like, "I think I've got my period." And she was like, "No, you can't, you're a year younger than me."
Hannah Witton
Oh my God, it's like this competition.
Gabby Edlin
It is, it's this thing about who's the most grown up.
A Peschanski
Exactly. And then so I kind of like told my mum, and she was like, "Yeah, I'll get you some tampons."
Hannah Witton
Oh, my mum was prepared. She just like had everything. You know.
Gabby Edlin
I wasn't allowed to use tampons for ages.
Katie Beales
I wasn't.
Hannah Witton
Oh, really? My mum made it her personal mission to have me and my sister using tampons from the get go. She was like, "Okay, let's go. Put your leg up!"
Gabby Edlin
That's really good. I think there's something really shaming about, no, you don't get to put something inside your vagina.
Hannah Witton
Yeah. But I feel like I'm going to be the same, like if I have kids who have periods. I'm gonna be the same about the menstrual cup. I'm like, I'll be like, "Come on, you can do it!"
Gabby Edlin
"We're gonna do the fold."
Hannah Witton
Even before they've started their period you're like, "Okay, show me the C fold."
Gabby Edlin
"And can you do the Z? Okay, good. Well done, sweetie pie." Yeah, yeah yeah, I'll be with you.
Hannah Witton
We'll run some classes, it'll be great. Um, what did you learn about periods in school? Like what was that education like?
A Peschanski
We learned about the science. So like we had, when was it, like the year before the year of GCSE equivalent?
Hannah Witton
So like year 10, when you're like 14/15.
A Peschanski
Yeah.
Hannah Witton
Wait, that's like that's really late to have the education.
A Peschanski
Yeah. Basically they were like okay, this is how the reproductive system works. Like very anatomically.
Gabby Edlin
So it was in biology.
A Peschanski
Yeah, it was in biology. It was like, this is what happens. And like kind of the same happened with the pill where they were like, this is what the pill does to like the anatomy of the human body, in a way. Like it was nothing personal at all, it was nothing about like each case is different, it was like this is how it happens, if it doesn't happen like that for you, something's wrong.
Hannah Witton
There's definitely no education on like, how to deal with having a period.
Gabby Edlin
No yeah, we didn't till we were 14. We had a talk when we were 14, and it was the woman from Tampax came in and she had pads and tampons, and it was like, this is it. And she was very like, okay ladies, right! This is, maybe it was your mum. You know, you've really sort of like, she'd obviously had to do it a lot and dealt with a lot of people giggling and so it was just like, goes like this, goes like this, in there. But by that time we'd all started, so we were all just like yeah, like none of us listened to anything. We all thought we were incredibly cool. And that was it. Yeah, there was no real like, this is what a period looks like, this is what a period feels, like this is how to no there's something wrong, or this isn't an average period. It was very much like, get your tampon, get your pad, off you go.
Hannah Witton
Off you go, oh yeah.
Katie Beales
I had mine in year six. Like, 10/11 I think.
Hannah Witton
Yeah.
Gabby Edlin
That's good.
Katie Beales
But it wasn't very informative. And I hadn't, I was way off starting my period at that point. So I found it quite scary. And it was just like, some people in the class have started their period, hands up if you've started your period.
A Peschanski
Oh my God.
Hannah Witton
Oh wow, just outing all of these children.
Katie Beales
And it was like, they split the guys and girls that they split us. The boys went off and we were just told they learnt how to masturbate.
Hannah Witton
Why didn't we get that class?
Gabby Edlin
Why did they not teach girls?
Katie Beales
That's what they said.
Gabby Edlin
That's, they probably learned about wet dreams.
Katie Beales
Yeah.
Gabby Edlin
But like, that implies that we're, they're saying, boys at some point you're going to learn how to masturbate.
Katie Beales
Yeah.
Gabby Edlin
But like girls, no, no, no, no. You're just gonna -
Hannah Witton
Boys, you get orgasm, girls, you get blood.
Katie Beales
Yeah, this is the sanitary towel. The moment you get your period, you can get pregnant. Yeah.
Gabby Edlin
Sorry, are we allowed to swear? No?
Hannah Witton
Yeah, yeah, yeah. Good.
Gabby Edlin
God, that's infuriating.
Hannah Witton
That was like when we were in school, but do you think there's still a taboo around periods now? Like, even in adulthood? Like how do you? Like, how do you see that like manifesting?
A Peschanski
I think it's mostly people being uncomfortable about the topic. Yeah. It's like as soon as you start talking about it, firstly, like all the annoying men just go [sounds of panic], "I don't wanna hear about this. I don't care." It's like, you really should.
Gabby Edlin
I found quite a lot that actually, of course, as a taboo, there is absolutely a taboo and there's no denying it, but we - like at Bloody Good Period, we just don't ever bother really talking about the taboo because once you've established there's a taboo, okay, well, what is what needs to be done now? Now you need to talk about the actual thing. And the more that you say, yeah, there's to be there's to be this taboo, you're just reinforcing that taboo and say yeah, the taboo's okay. And actually, that it's really funny because whenever - we have - we now, like, do a thing called stay in the room when we talk to men about periods and actually, like, I often find that once you've broken through that, like very first like [sounds of blustering] "Okay, we're gonna talk about periods, haha," they're absolutely fine about it. They want to, they want to know, they've got questions, okay, they might not have the education that we have, but that's not their fault. It's because they were sent out the room to talk about wanking. Actually, most of them they want to know, and they're interested because a lot of them might have female partners or, you know, really close friends who menstruate as well. And, like, we - I think we've allowed like the male population to keep this taboo for themselves where we're like, "No taboo, no taboo, okay, yeah, poor boys, you've got a taboo." and actually, like, none of us really want it. No one, the only places that are profiting from it are the ones that really shouldn't be.
Hannah Witton
I find in the comments on my, like the Hormone Diaries videos, there's a lot of comments being like, "I'm a guy, and I'm watching that. Is this weird?" And then there's loads of comments that continue to be like, "No, I'm a guy and I'm here too." And I'm like, yeah.
Katie Beales
That's amazing. And it's, it's education, right? And I think there is - I see a taboo but it's because of education, particularly with men. But my, my partner now knows absolutely everything about periods. Like he's brilliant, but when I first met him, he was like, "Oh, okay, so can you like, can you pee when you have a tampon in?" And he was like embarrassed about it.
Gabby Edlin
I remember having that question when I was like, 12. I did not understand that they were different holes.
Katie Beales
And I sort of ridiculed him first. And I was like, actually -
Hannah Witton
Where would you have learned that? Yeah.
Katie Beales
- no one told him that. I always felt sorry for him that he had no idea.
Hannah Witton
I remember when I first started using a menstrual cup and I was like, "Oh my god, this is fascinating. I can like see it in there." And I like called in my partner like, "Look at this!"
Gabby Edlin
I think it's amazing to see it there. I mean, I love nothing more than to be like yes, this is very j 3 to know myself, but yeah, I'm happy to show anybody.
Hannah Witton
Oh my god, is there like an Instagram account of people's like pictures of full menstrual cups. I mean, I wonder if that would get flagged? I wonder if they'd get rid of that.
Gabby Edlin
Yeah, they don't like pictures of discharge as we discovered today. Maisie Hill just got deleted. So I just put a picture up of my spit in my fingers and put it next to it and was like, "Okay, what's the difference?" Cuz she's - she's incredible. She's talking about cervical fluid that no one ever talks about and then Instagram deleted because it violates community standards. Like, what because it came from a vagina? That's why it violates community standards. Like let's all just you know, let's be open about it.
Hannah Witton
It's like the context that offends people rather than like the image itself. That's really interesting. I wanted to talk a bit more about your experiences because what like when did you realise that you were non binary? And did that have an effect on like, your relationship with your period and how you felt about it?
A Peschanski
Yeah, well, quite late, actually. Because like I've always felt very different. No, I'm joking, I'm not gonna go that route. But yeah, basically I came out as gay when I was in my last year of high school. Like it took me a while to get there because the media does not help you. And I learned everything about me and the world through the media. And so yeah, the summer before I started my last year of high school I ended up watching like Glee and Skins and like Grey's Anatomy and stuff like that and like I always was like, "Oh, my favourite character is always the lesbian. I wonder why?" And then suddenly it clicked but yeah, it took me another like three years after that to like figure out gender not because I had not been exposed to it but because I'd not been exposed to it in the media. Like I only had my friends and I was like, "No, I don't correspond to any of those."
Hannah Witton
If you're not given any other options, like how do you know they're out there?
A Peschanski
Exactly and I ended up scrolling through Tumblr and like watching things, and then I watched Carmila, the web series.
Hannah Witton
I don't know that.
A Peschanski
It's about vampires, and there's lesbians. So it's quite good. In that there's, there's a non binary scientist, and I was like, I could get behind that. I am a scientist. And that was kind of the moment when there was no like big revelation. It was kind of like, Oh, it's always been there. Like, I've never, I never liked to be associated with womanhood, but I never felt like a man either. And so yeah, it was kind of like the easy to me, it was like, suddenly, it was so easy. And I was like, oh, then maybe that's why, like, I really hated my period, like my period was the worst. And it's always been the worst, because like adenomyosis, which we might talk about later. And so basically, I was like, I didn't understand the feelings and why I felt so bad during my periods. And then I started, like, looking stuff up in my YouTube was the biggest help. And yeah, kind of understanding that it was dysphoria that I felt, and it was kind of the idea that, that didn't like having a period made me feel bad, because it didn't align with who I felt I was. But yeah, that's kind of like -
Hannah Witton
Did you feel like, you were like, this thing shouldn't be happening to me or like -
A Peschanski
Yeah, it was it was mostly, it was mostly like this thing, everywhere, I've always heard this thing is for women. And I was like, I'm not a woman. I don't think I should be, like getting this. And like, at that point, I was very much like, I don't want children. I never wanted children. I probably never will want children. That's changed a bit. But like, at that point, I was like, I don't want it's, I really don't want it. And it's there. And there's nothing I can do about it. And he's always horrible. It's like, every other week for seven whole days. And it was really -
Hannah Witton
Every other week. Yeah. Oh my goodness. Wow, that is bad in itself without the dysphoria, but -
Gabby Edlin
On top of it, that's a lot of time spent being not happy with your own body, which is not a nice thing to be
A Peschanski
No, it was not great.
Hannah Witton
And that's an interesting thing you brought up about how periods are so associated with womanhood, like we were all taught, like, oh, when you get your period, that is you becoming a woman and everything around it is super gendered.
A Peschanski
Like feminine hygiene.
Hannah Witton
Yeah,
Gabby Edlin
I mean, feminine and hygiene, like the two words that just should. Oh, hygiene. Your period's not dirty. Yeah, not dirty. It's just - it's just fluid. Yeah.
Hannah Witton
Language is so interesting, because I only realised this when we were having that conversation recently about how we call them sanitary products. Oh, yeah. My whole life. I've just been calling them that, because that was the word that I was told.
Gabby Edlin
That was the word invented.
Hannah Witton
And that's the word that's on all of the signs, like dispose of your sanitary products in the sanitary bin. Yeah.
Gabby Edlin
That's, that's what's different about the menstrual cup is that you're like, this is unsanitary. And it's healthy. And it's fine. Yeah.
Hannah Witton
Because with the work that you do with Bloody Good Periods, that is all very inclusive, and you're very, like, deliberate with the language that you use, which I think is amazing,
Gabby Edlin
Just the first time we when I've set it up. I was using I was I hadn't even thought I was saying women and girls, you know, women and girls and people who, you know, not even people. And then just I think it was like really, really quickly. Just a couple of people messaged me on instagram about it. And they were suchjust like I'm non binary. I feel a bit excluded by this. And then it just clicked and I was just like, of course, of course. And so we just checked it didn't feel like a decision. It just was like the like, obviously now we'll include everybody because we haven't thought to. But yeah, I think you have it we get a lot of pushback for it because people do want to, you know, there is some sort of radical feminist that really want it to just be it's about women, but actually it's not because not all women menstruate, not all people who menstruate are women. But I think it very importantly is that if we just define like, what a woman is by if she's bleeding, like what are we saying about you know, people who have gone through menopause or people who might not ever have a period but I identify as women or people who identify as women who have a hysterectomy, you know, we just sort of carve ourselves into this tiny little corner and actually, like it doesn't help any of us.
Hannah Witton
Yeah, it excludes more people than you realise. What what do you all think of the words menstruaters and bleeders?
Gabby Edlin
I'll take 'em. I mean, that's what it is, isn't it with like, we bleed like, okay, we don't cut and bleed but like, and we menstruate. It's not saying that we walk around this world going I'm a menstruator and that is how I defined myself and you are a menstruator, you're not a menstruator. It's like when we're talking. We're here at a roundtable talking about periods in this context. Yeah, surely menstruating is adequate. Yeah, that's for me. I don't know about anybody else like me - I like it.
Hannah Witton
Except I sometimes find it hard to stay say cuz I can't I can't get the R right. Yeah, I'm like, menstruate. I like no, I really like bleeders. Um, Katie, so you have endometriosis? What is that? First of all?
Katie Beales
So, endometriosis affects one in 10 bleeders.
Gabby Edlin
Do you have to have a period to have into endometriosis. Or can it just be that you can have a womb? Sorry, I've asked you a very technical question.
Katie Beales
Yes, no, ah, um, so it's defined as tissue similar to that that we find inside the womb, the endometrium, outside of the womb.
Hannah Witton
So it can be found on the ovaries, fallopian tubes,
Katie Beales
So it can be on your reproductive system, and it can be elsewhere. So I had it on my bladder. I have it on my bowels. your diaphragm, in your lungs. They've even found it in the brain.
Hannah Witton
How did it get up there?
Gabby Edlin
What is it? It's the tissue?
Katie Beales
Yeah, similar? Similar. They still don't know exactly what it is.
Oh wow, I'm not surprised.
Katie Beales
So - yeah, right. They don't know what it is. There's no cure for it. Uh huh.
Gabby Edlin
And it's pain - incredibly painful?
Hannah Witton
Yeah.
Katie Beales
So yes, and no, because it depends on the person. It depends. There is no correlation between the amount of pain you have and the amount of disease that you have.
Hannah Witton
And by the amount of disease, that means the amount of like tissue that -
Katie Beales
Yeah, is found elsewhere. So it, it goes elsewhere in the body. And then every time you have a period, it bleeds, but it's got nowhere to go. So it just stays there, it bleeds.
Hannah Witton
So that's what causes the pain. That sounds -
Katie Beales
So it's like an inflammation, because you can have the pain whilst you're on your period. But then you can also just have it all the time. And it's just a chronic pain. And that's how it got for me. First of all, it was just my periods. And that happened for so long. And then I just had chronic pain. And I found it hard to walk, like my tubes were twisted and like stuck to my abdomen. And I had no idea. And it was only at that point that I started seeing a doctor and found out it was endometriosis
Hannah Witton
Yeah. because there's a really long time that it takes for people to get a diagnosis. It's like the average's like eight to 10 years or something like that.
Katie Beales
And it took me nine years. Well, because, again, when it comes to education, I wasn't told about painful periods and what is the painful period and what's normal. So I always felt I was normal. I was in like debilitating pain from the get go as soon as I had my period. I was in bed crying. Like it was so painful. It made me sick. And I thought that was normal. Because I was never told otherwise.
Hannah Witton
Because we're we're all kind of taught that like if you menstruate that pain is like a normal part of that same way that like the first time you have sex, it's gonna be painful. Like all these things, it's like for having a womb it's just like, life is just gonna be painful. But you're not actually given any any indication of what is normal and what is like actually you should probably go to a doctor because you don't have to suffer like this.
Katie Beales
Exactly. And I went to the doctor over and over again, over nine years, I was fobbed off.
A Peschanski
That's the thing, doctors don't believe you. Yeah.
Gabby Edlin
Yeah, they don't know.
Hannah Witton
Yeah, no, your condition is quite similar. What is the name of that?
A Peschanski
Adenomyosis which is the same thing where some of the tissue goes away but it stays in the like uterus muscle. It just makes it really painful and like very heavy, which is like the symptom is it's very heavy periods. And they're very long and the cycles are very short which is like it should have clicked sooner. And like somehow it didn't and, and yeah, diagnosis also took forever because my gynaecologist - because in France you go to your gynaecologist every year from the moment you're like 16, pretty much, like it's encouraged to do that. But like she didn't believe me, she was like, yeah, you're just - because like I have quite high pain tolerance. And so I kind of like, downplayed it a little bit. And then, like, I had horrible back pain, like forever and that was the thing I went to see in osteopath for the back pain and she was like, that doesn't sound like back pain to me. And she's the one who was like you should go see a gynaecologist after and like it wasn't an MRI it was like a - ultrasound that's what's it's called. An ultrasound. And then I went see her again and she was like, oh yeah, lol sorry.
Hannah Witton
What is daily life with endometriosis like for you?
Katie Beales
Gosh, it can differ. I still have quite painful periods. I had very good treatment, but I'm lucky to have had good treatment.
Hannah Witton
Have you had a laparoscopy? So that's the surgery.
Katie Beales
So how I've had three? No, it's kind of when they - they go
Gabby Edlin
They burn -
Katie Beales
Well, that's what you don't want -
Gabby Edlin
You don't want that.
Hannah Witton
They burn it off?
Katie Beales
So I've had that twice, and so they put a little hole by your belly button they go in next and pump up your belly with air, and then they look around, see if they can find endometriosis. Now the majority of gynaecologists burn it away with like ablation surgery, but endometriosis, you have to think of it like an iceberg. If you're burning away you're just getting that tip and there's that bulk of it left behind. So I had that a few times and it just did not help me. And then when I started doing research connecting with the online community, I then found out about the thing called excision surgery and that's when they go in like the same but they cut it away and they get they get that whole iceberg and that can give you so much relief and it's given me a lot of relief.
Hannah Witton
Yeah because people with endometriosis tend to like have to have multiple surgeries throughout their life.
Katie Beales
Yeah right and then they say with excision if you have like a really really good surgery where they cut it all away, you shouldn't need to have these repeats actually.
Gabby Edlin
It doesn't grow back, or?
Katie Beales
5 to 10 years you should be good but with like burning it away that that could be months -
Gabby Edlin
That's just taking the surface off.
Katie Beales
Yeah, real short term.
Hannah Witton
Have you had to have any surgeries because of yours?
A Peschanski
No, I actually my doctor put me on the pill so I just don't have my period and I haven't had my period in two years.
A Peschanski
Yeah the progesterone only and yeah, basically I've been on the pill before to try and regulate the fact that my period was horrible. I could not stand the pill. Like just I couldn't do it. Like I had all the side effects and it was really horrible.
Hannah Witton
The progesterone only?
Hannah Witton
Was that with the combined one? So it had oestrogen in it as well?
A Peschanski
Yeah that was that was ages ago. It was like four or five years ago. I had that for like six months, tried three different ones and then my gynaecologist was like you know what? You don't need it. Just don't do it. And I was like yes, I will gladly take that advice. And so when I came back she was like, like I'm gonna have to put you on the pill again because there's no other option for you. And I was like oh, is there really nothing else? Because I was before what she'd done is she put me on really strong painkillers that I had to take during my period and that was fine for me like I started to like be fine with that but i they're not meant to be long term solution and so she was like yeah, the pill is the only solution but I'll give you like the smallest amount of pill that I can possibly give you and so it's like this - it's just a pill that I take every day and I just haven't had my periods in two years and it's actually solve the problem.
Hannah Witton
Does it help with your dysphoria as well then? Yeah.
A Peschanski
Yeah, immensely because like I don't have a period anymore. So that part -
Hannah Witton
Two birds one stone.
A Peschanski
Exactly. It was actually kind of, I mean, I still hate being on the pill and I wish that someday I'll find something that can do the job without me having to be on the pill. Because no money is put into research about wombs and periods then I doubt that's gonna happen anytime soon. And but if it does then I'll gladly do that. But yeah, basically it's been really good cuz obviously since I don't have my periods anymore than I don't think about womanhood once a month.
Hannah Witton
It's not confronting you in, your underwear.
A Peschanski
Yeah, it's like it's not - it's not there and so it's been much better definitely.
Gabby Edlin
I mean, like discover it - so I I'm not on any contraception but I tracked my period with an app, with Clue, and the discovery of -
Hannah Witton
How you fee? Do you track your mood?
Gabby Edlin
Your mood and like how I feel about like when I'm when I'm ovulating is completely different before than before my period and like i mean it's it's been actually like really invigorating and really empowering actually. Because I know what do you know what at this point in the month or you know my 30 day cycle, I'm just not going to feel great and that's okay and you just need to look after yourself and just you know, stay inside more but then there's a part of the of the cycle where I'm like a machine you know, I am like getting stuff done left right and centre and so I try and like plan my work not my work day but my work life around my cycle because it make your period work for you. It works for me. Yeah, I'm like, okay, when I've got this really big thing to bash out, like, save that for like, day two to day twelve. Like, if you've just got to get a lot of reading done, like just leave that until just before the period otherwise, you know, you're just gonna, like, you're going to be like bursting with like, energy and womb stuff. There'll be eggs flying everywhere.
Hannah Witton
Creme eggs!
Gabby Edlin
Yeah! No, that's not how periods work. You don't get eggs flying everywhere. But yeah, that's been really interesting for me. But I don't because it's just still on the app I don't trust is for contraception. I don't think I would, yeah, I don't think I would be like, oh, it's fine. Because I'm, you know, I'm not ovulating. There's like -
Hannah Witton
A next level of like data collecting that you need to do with that because those apps can kind of estimate your fertile window. But by no means, the exact day you will ovulate.
Gabby Edlin
Yeah, exactly. And also learning about like, how, so you can sort of find out more about like, where you're discharge - I'm fascinated by discharge.
Hannah Witton
Oh, my God. Yeah, the different - different textures.
Gabby Edlin
Like your discharge is and that's how you know you're ovulating.
Katie Beales
I was blown away by I mean, it's - I had no idea.
Gabby Edlin
It's fascinating. This has been kept secret from us.
Katie Beales
Yeah. Why weren't we taught that?
Gabby Edlin
Yeah, I know.
Katie Beales
It's the egg white -
Gabby Edlin
Why the egg white is to catch sperm.
Katie Beales
That's when you're really fertile.
Gabby Edlin
It's like a superhero thing. It is literally like Spider Man coming out of your vagina go, "Right, sperm. Come on. I'm gonna keep hold of you." And then other days, it's like, "No, we don't care." Like, you know.
Hannah Witton
The discharge to like, bat them away.
Katie Beales
I was reading your book. And it was saying about, like that egg white? And it was explained in it. And it was saying, okay, so sometimes in the month, you may feel like a bit wet in your underwear, but you haven't been turned on? It's because you're ovulating. And I was like, "Oh my goodness, that's what it is." Yeah. Cuz I always feel like, I didn't feel and yeah, why am I feeling this down here?
Gabby Edlin
Yeah. It's and once it's a cervical mucus, and once you start to recognise where it is, you're like, ready for it? And you're like, mmhmm, ovulating. Yeah, yeah. Just before my period. Yeah.
Hannah Witton
And you've used like, the tracking thing, but you used it to help you get pregnant?
Katie Beales
Yeah, so I, you, yeah, use the tracking to get pregnant. And that was amazing. And that's how I learned about this fertility awareness method. And I felt like I've missed out so much in my life, not knowing about that. But now that I've had a baby, I just do everything backwards. I just flip it upside down. I still have the same app. But what was helping -
Hannah Witton
Instead of like, having the most sex during the time you're like, avoid? Yeah.
Katie Beales
Yes, I just do it all backwards now. And it works for me. At the moment.
Gabby Edlin
Yeah. And we just didn't know this stuff. Did we? At school. I had no clue about any of this stuff until my friends all started having children. And I was just like, "Oh, you can't get sex -" You can't get sex. You can't. You can't - you can have sex. You can't get pregnant every day of your cycle.
Katie Beales
With my boyfriend, I was just like, "Look at it. Look at it."
Gabby Edlin
It doesn't sing but if you want it to.
Hannah Witton
Just boomerang it. Boomerang your discharge. Oh, I love it. That's a really interesting point, though about, like, being able to get pregnant, because in school, like, sex ed is very much like how to not get pregnant. And so when you're taught how to not get pregnant, they, like fail to tell us that actually, for some people, it's for most people, it's actually difficult to get pregnant because there is only this window. And I remember reading recently, that one randomly at one randomly timed act of penis and vagina intercourse, the likelihood of that resulting in a pregnancy is 3%. And you're like, say what?
Gabby Edlin
Yeah, like, genuinely in my head it's like 100%.
Hannah Witton
Yeah. But I understand, like, why we drill this into young people, because if we told everyone like, actually, there's only a 3% chance, but that's from one time, if you've been having like sex a lot, then obviously your chances increase. But what it means is that you're like, you know, young people might go and have unprotected sex anyway. And then they're not getting pregnant. And they're like, well, I must be infertile, and then continue and then get pregnant. And we're just not taught about that window. And then, like you said, like reverse engineering and but it is, it's there's a lot of work involved in using that method correctly, which is why we don't tell people about it because there's so much room for error.
Katie Beales
And I think they say if you follow it, you know, there's a really, there's a really, really slim chance you could get pregnant if you're following it, you kind of have to be aware of that. If you were like 100% if I was to get pregnant - like I do not want a baby 100% then they would say it's not the best thing for you to do. Because there is that. But this is a tiny amount. The same with like the pill form of contraception,
Hannah Witton
There's just a lot I think it like the fertility awareness method, it like suits a certain type of person. And I think that person is like someone who's probably in a relationship, not the end of the world, if they do get pregnant, someone who has a regular sleep pattern because you have to take your temperature every morning at the same time. And if you are ill, hungover, or like have slept more or less than you normally do, then that can affect your temperature. If you travel a lot, so like changing timezone also affects it.
Gabby Edlin
Of course, yeah.
Katie Beales
Yeah.
Hannah Witton
Yeah, it is, exactly, and so it only really works for like, a small amount of people, which is why I get that you don't you don't encourage like teenagers to like, like, go forth, you'll be fine. Like maybe not.
Gabby Edlin
But I think with that that's because the way that we do teach contraception to young people is like, there's nothing to do with pleasure. There's nothing to do with really relationship, I mean, maybe there is now but certainly not when I was at school. There's nothing to do with like healthy relationships, there's nothing to do with anything that isn't penis and vagina sex.
Hannah Witton
How to avoid getting pregnant: don't have sex with a penis.
Katie Beales
One method of contraception
Gabby Edlin
Or like you know it, but it's also about like STI's, don't catch STI's. Which, I mean good, probably don't catch STI's. But like, if you're just making it so completely binary, you're not really, it's not just that you're forgetting the people in the middle, but the people the middle are lost. You know, like, if you're like, if you're not learning that actually sex doesn't have to be penis in vagina, then you are maybe at risk of not having a fulfilling relationship because maybe you don't want to have that kind of sex because and then you think you are lacking whereas actually you're just having sex the way you want to have sex.
Hannah Witton
Yeah.
Gabby Edlin
Does that makes sense?
Hannah Witton
Makes a lot of sense.
Katie Beales
It makes sense, right, yeah.
Hannah Witton
So if you could switch off your period, like no side effects, none of that. No, you don't have to take like a hormonal pill to do it. But if you could just be like, period to be gone. Would you?
A Peschanski
Yes. 100%, yes.
Hannah Witton
You're like, yes, I'm done with that, I'm out.
A Peschanski
I'm just done with it, I've had enough.
Hannah Witton
You sound like you've got your periods like working for you.
Gabby Edlin
I don't think I would. I think because I work in periods now, I am very, very lucky in that my life can work around my period, because it has to. But it's not that heavy, it's regular to the day.
Hannah Witton
I'm so jealous.
Gabby Edlin
It's, yeah, it's really sort of, it's not that painful. I mean, I do get period pains, but it's doable. And there's just something about it, I just do think I don't know if I would give it up actually, because it connects maybe in a sort of almost like completely opposite way, it connects me with my self, and not in a sort of hippie dippie, like, I don't want to sit in a red tent with anyone. But I like knowing how my body's working, and it does feel manageable.
Hannah Witton
Yeah.
Gabby Edlin
But I realise that I'm so incredibly lucky that it is a manageable period and that it can fit into my life, the way that, you know, works for me.
Hannah Witton
Yeah.
Katie Beales
100% I'd turn it off.
Hannah Witton
Oh really, is that because of the endometriosis?
Katie Beales
Yes.
Hannah Witton
Yeah
Katie Beales
For that reason, yes. Because if I never had a period, my belief is that I wouldn't have endometriosis.
Gabby Edlin
You wouldn't have pain.
Katie Beales
Exactly that. But there is some thought that it may be oestrogen dependent and can it produce its own oestrogen?
Hannah Witton
What!
Katie Beales
I don't know. But yeah, I would happily say goodbye to it. But then there is that small part of me that feels it connects me to my body, and there's something really natural about it. I don't know.
Gabby Edlin
Yeah.
A Peschanski
Yeah.
Hannah Witton
It's, it's an interesting one.
Katie Beales
I don't enjoy my period, I hate it. It gives me so much pain, it gives me this chronic pain. There's just something about it.
Gabby Edlin
I feel like when when mine's finished though, I feel like a sense of like relief and elation, which is almost like you know, like you have the highs and the lows. And like, to me, that that is something that I would rather have than not, than not have anything at all. But also I just don't feel like - we're not - we're not in a world that's set up to manage periods. We're just simply not. And so maybe if the world was different, if the workplace was different, if you know, we understood like if just everything was different, it wasn't so completely tied to being a woman, it would all feel like it was just just a part of life. Just having a headache, just like blowing your nose, you know, it's a bit icky, it's a bit annoying, but it's just part of life. And you know, you don't have to skip work, you'd have to skip school, you don't have to go and lie on your bed, because there are ways that we've worked out that mean that it's okay to have a period.
Katie Beales
Yeah.
Gabby Edlin
You know.
Hannah Witton
Yeah. I think, well, I have switched mine off. So I think I'm probably like, yeah, would also get rid, but not necessarily because the period itself was bad. Like, I think I'm the same as you, like the period was manageable, like a bit of period pain, but like, fine. My issue was other period bodily side effects, like my boobs would ache for two weeks before I would come on. So for like, 14 days, it was like to the tee, and this is another thing that I learned from doing the period tracking app, because I was like, oh, my tits are hurting, I'll log that in. And then I remember looking at the data and being like, oh, okay, so my tits, and it was like, so painful, so heavy, couldn't like properly hug people. I'd be like, stay away, and it would just be -
Gabby Edlin
I'm getting this, yeah.
Hannah Witton
It would just be the worst two weeks, and I'd be so grateful for my period arrived. Usually day two of my period, it was like, my tits feel light again, like oh my God, I can walk around like a normal human being. Like, I'd be taking my bra off in the evening, and as the bra was coming off, I'd have like a hand and ready to catch it, because if it actually dropped, I'd be like, fuck, so painful. And then I just got the coil and I'm not dealing with it anymore.
Gabby Edlin
Now you say that, now that I've like been tracking my period, I'm like, oh yeah, I have noticed that my boobs are really really sensitive before and it is almost unbearable. And I think that I wouldn't have noticed that if I hadn't been tracking.
Hannah Witton
Yeah, cuz you just kind of go, oh, it's just my tits sometimes, but then once you start putting the data in, you're like, oh, it's not sometimes, it's these specific days, every month.
Gabby Edlin
Yeah.
Hannah Witton
Yeah, that's interesting. So we've talked a bit about contraception. But I wanted to, like dive into that stuff a bit more. What was your, like education about it in school, because I feel like we've mentioned that if we got any sex education at all, it was how to not get pregnant. And so a lot of contraception was involved in that. Like, for me, we had a nurse come in and just go, this is the pill, this is this thing, this is this thing. And even though that was maybe the most thorough education I had, like sex ed that I had, I still, as an adult, was clueless about actually how they worked, what they did to your body, how to talk about them, what options there are, I don't know, what was your experience with that?
Katie Beales
Mine, mine was at a like sexual health clinic
Hannah Witton
Oh, really
Katie Beales
I don't know, like at school, the same as when we're talking about periods, like everyone wants their period, have you had your period, that you're in the in crowd. Then you have that have you had sex yet? And all my group of friends were having sex. So then like oh, so I have my period, I started having sex, therefore, I need to go on the pill. And I had started my period, but I wasn't having sex. But still, I went to the sexual health clinic because I wanted to be on the pill, because I wanted to say I was having sex.
Hannah Witton
Oh really.
Katie Beales
Yeah, it was like a thing, it was where I grew up. I grew up in Essex, I don't know if that's why. But it was a thing.
Gabby Edlin
Yeah
Hannah Witton
That is so interesting.
Katie Beales
To go to the sexual health clinic.
Hannah Witton
It was like a status symbol.
Katie Beales
Yeah, exactly that
Katie Beales
It was like oh, I need to get my pills, so I don't get pregnant.
Gabby Edlin
Oh, wow
Hannah Witton
So I don't get pregnant.
Katie Beales
And that was my experience initially with the pill. And then, as time went on, it was then when I started visiting a doctor because my periods were so painful that then they started trying me on different pills. I tried so many, because I got really bad side effects. Like the first ones I had headaches, mood swings, I felt so unwell. And then they changed it again, and take it back to back, but then I would bleed constantly. So for me, the pill never worked.
Hannah Witton
Yeah.
Katie Beales
Like for my period, I didn't get pregnant but -
Hannah Witton
Did you have any other stuff, like did you ever try like the implant or -
Katie Beales
I had the coil, I had the mirena coil.
Hannah Witton
That's the one I have.
Katie Beales
Which, first of all, I liked it. First of all, when I heard about the coil, I actually thought would be like a spring.
Gabby Edlin
Yeah, I definitely thought that.
Katie Beales
It goes like, and then up and round.
Hannah Witton
I don't know what I thought.
Gabby Edlin
And like catches them!
Katie Beales
Shoot them back up.
Hannah Witton
Slinky in your womb.
Gabby Edlin
Eggs go up, sperm goes down.
Katie Beales
So that's what I thought it was, first of all. But then I found out more about the mirena. I had that put in under general anaesthetic, after I had surgery.
Hannah Witton
Oh.
Katie Beales
It was done at the same time.
Hannah Witton
I wish I'd had general anaesthetic.
Gabby Edlin
Yeah, oh wow.
Katie Beales
But again, painful. They say if you haven't had a child, it can be incredibly painful, because your body tries to expel it, because it's a foreign body.
Hannah Witton
Yeah.
A Peschanski
Oh my god.
Hannah Witton
Mine was, so they gave me a local anaesthetic injection, so actually putting it in I didn't feel because they injected - injected my cervix, which hurt.
Gabby Edlin
Oh my God, they injected your cervix!
Hannah Witton
Yeah.
Gabby Edlin
Oh God, how long was the needle?
Hannah Witton
I don't know, I didn't see it, I was like lying back. But yeah, I didn't actually feel them putting the coil in, but I had the pain afterwards.
Katie Beales
The pain was out of this world.
Hannah Witton
I like you know you said, like in so much pain. Thought I was gonna vomit.
Katie Beales
It was horrible, and I bled for eight weeks straight.
Gabby Edlin
Oh.
Hannah Witton
I bled for a month, but it was mostly spotting and then after that, like I've had nothing.
Katie Beales
Yeah, that's good. It was all right for me for a while, six months, amazing. No periods, no pain, but and I don't know, it just kind of wore off.
Hannah Witton
Yeah, that can happen sometimes though.
Katie Beales
And I had the same with that. Then the strings were too long, I had problems with the strings.
Hannah Witton
Oh really.
Katie Beales
Yeah.
Hannah Witton
I couldn't find mine for ages. I was like, where are they? My fingers are too short, I can't find my string. And then my doctor was just like, no, you should be able to feel them. And then I really tried, and then I felt them. I was like, I will find them!
Hannah Witton
So what were you taught about contraception in school?
A Peschanski
Nothing.
Hannah Witton
Nada.
A Peschanski
I mean, apart from like
Hannah Witton
Even in France?
A Peschanski
Yeah, it was like, this is what taking the pill does to your cycle. But like nothing about the different kinds of pills, nothing about side effects, nothing about, nothing basically. We didn't even have the like, put the condom on the banana.
Gabby Edlin
Yeah, I didn't have that, I never condomed a banana.
Hannah Witton
I had that. But we put it on a test tube, which is the wrong size.
Gabby Edlin
The little tiny test tubes?
Hannah Witton
Yeah, the little tiny science test tube.
Gabby Edlin
That would be very disappointing.
A Peschanski
So this is what penises look like.
Gabby Edlin
Nah, not gonna bother.
Hannah Witton
Be careful with them, they might shatter. So like, I love your story about why you went on the pill. That's just really funny, but kind of sad, I don't know.
Gabby Edlin
Yeah, but it is.
Hannah Witton
But why did you start on contraception? Because I feel like we have this assumption that if you're on the pill, then it's like, oh, you're sexually active. But people go on the pill for all sorts of reasons.
Gabby Edlin
I went on it for irregular periods. So I mean, but looking back, I was only having periods for four years. So of course they were still irregular, a bit. But it was, I was finding it really stressful. I was in sixth form, and so I went to the doctors and they put me on the pill, and then I was basically on the pill, this was before I was like, before I had like penetrative sex. So this was, I was on the pill then for like 12/13 years.
Hannah Witton
Wow.
Gabby Edlin
So as the same as you, like a few different ones, like just some didn't quite work, some made me like really angry, I probably was very angry anyway. And like, some made me overly emotional, some made me eat all the time. And then yeah, then I just was on it, and on it, and on it, and just had never even thought about the fact that oh god, my body is just being pumped with hormones every month, all the time. And I know we have a bit of a thing now because we're now we're looking more into like natural cycles and thinking more about hormones. I know hormones aren't inherently bad for you.
Hannah Witton
It's definitely a bit zeitgeisty though, like.
Gabby Edlin
Yeah.
Hannah Witton
Because I came off the pill, which is what started the whole like Hormone Diaries thing when I was 24 and I'd been on the pill for seven years.
Gabby Edlin
Yeah.
Hannah Witton
By that point. I was like, who am I?
Gabby Edlin
Yeah, I felt like that. So I was from 17 to 31, I was on the pill. And then was just like,I want to go free range.
Hannah Witton
So many egg puns!
Gabby Edlin
It is not Easter anymore! But yeah, I just really wanted to just, I wanted to know what my body was like. I wasn't in a relationship, like I felt like okay, just just try it. I don't know what difference there is. But now I sort of don't really want to go back on, because I'm just like, well, I'm coping fine and I'm happy with the barrier method for sex. But like, it is this, I don't know, I just have felt consistently like I don't know what is going on. I don't know why I was put on it. I don't know what it was doing to my body. Didn't realise it wasn't actually a period for, because you know when you have -
Hannah Witton
The withdrawal bleed.
Gabby Edlin
The withdrawal bleed.
Hannah Witton
Which you don't actually have.
Gabby Edlin
You don't have to have. It was because of the Pope. The Pope didn't think that Catholic women should be allowed to be on contraception unless it seemed like they were women, and having their periods.
Katie Beales
Really?
Hannah Witton
To make it like more appeasing.
Katie Beales
Wow.
Gabby Edlin
That they're still women because they're bleeding. Like, yeah, horrific.
Katie Beales
Oh my goodness.
Gabby Edlin
So I don't know why, so basically I was just stopping my periods and fucking up my ovaries for however many years. But luckily they came back, and we're just like -
Hannah Witton
Your ovaries came back
Gabby Edlin
The ovaries came back, yeah.
Hannah Witton
Full throttle.
Gabby Edlin
But it's really, it's quite terrifying like this seven day thing, because it's just basically you're turning off off off off your ovaries, and all of a sudden they start waking back up again, and start like producing, dunno, again.
Katie Beales
Science
Gabby Edlin
Science. And that's the bit that you can get pregnant in, because you're more likely to get the day wrong when you're then starting the pill, unless you have like the sugar pills. But it's all just like, yeah, I feel like completely, like, there's so much stuff that I just don't know, but I was just doing this for decades, because that's what you do.
Hannah Witton
Yeah.
Gabby Edlin
Like even, like, that's what you do as a young woman. You take the pill, cuz you got to protect your own body, and it's, you know, the onus isn't on anyone else.
Katie Beales
You don't want to get pregnant.
Hannah Witton
Yeah, I went on the pill when I was 17, and that was because I was like having regular sex with my partner, and so I was like, I should have like an extra method.
Gabby Edlin
That's sensible.
Hannah Witton
But, I hadn't even thought that any of the other options that were out there, were for me. I kind of saw them as like, oh, the first thing that everyone does is go on the pill. It wasn't like, yeah, something like the implant or the coil. I was like, oh, that's for like, older people, who've already had children.
Katie Beales
That's exactly what I thought.
Gabby Edlin
I think I had that sort of thinking as well. Like, no, I won't do that. I don't, no.
Hannah Witton
But you go to the doctor and you go, I want to go on the pill. And the doctor just goes, okay, and then ask you some questions. But they don't go, have you thought about other options?
Gabby Edlin
Yeah, I definitely think that I considered the pill to be like a grown up, cool, that's what you did. You know, like not even, like I'm not even embarrassed about it now. Like that, like looking back, that was, it was it was a way of showing that you were growing up. And, yeah, an adult. Yeah, look at me taking hormones.
Katie Beales
Even now, when I had my son, the first appointment I had with the midwife was, are you taking contraception yet?
Gabby Edlin
Why isn't the onus on men?
Katie Beales
I was like wow. Like that's the first thing you should think of, like days out of a hospital, is -
Hannah Witton
You don't want to do that again.
Katie Beales
Your hormones are literally everywhere. I mean, fair point
Gabby Edlin
Why is there not, why are we not in a situation, in 2019, where if you're in a heterosexual relationship, and you've just had a baby, your male partner is being encouraged to take some birth control, that hasn't been invented yet. Because it made men too moody, blah blah blah. But like, why is that not what's going on? Why is it that we're still pumping our bodies full of hormones?
Katie Beales
Yeah, and your hormones that are absolutely everywhere. But yeah, take some -
Gabby Edlin
Take some more.
Hannah Witton
Yeah. It's almost like, just let your body like, just settle down after that whirlwind.
Katie Beales
I think that's what scares me now about going on contraceptives, because I don't know what one I'd want to take.
Gabby Edlin
Yeah.
Katie Beales
And I don't know, I feel more like me now. And I still have these highs and lows, I get PMS, but I don't know, I'm scared of that going away. I don't I don't like PMS, but -
Hannah Witton
Yeah, I definitely had that like coming off the pill being like, I'm gonna get to know my body, and all of that. And then for some, it's like, yeah, no, this is cool, I can live with this. For me, I was like, never mind, cool, nice to meet you, you're not my friend. But I do think like, it can be empowering for people both ways, like empowering to be like, this is what my body does without any synthetic hormones in it. And then it can also be empowering for people to be like, hey, you don't have to have your period. If you want to stop it, you can stop it, like there are ways. And yeah, I think it is nice to have those options. But it would be really great if they sorted out getting some contraception for people with sperm.
Gabby Edlin
Yeah, come on, did you hear about that though?
Hannah Witton
I did. But for the Hormone Diaries book, I did do a bit more research into it. It's a bit more complicated, but we can still be angry, we can still be angry.
Gabby Edlin
Because it still doesn't exist yet. Why does it not exist?
Katie Beales
How many men would take it?
Hannah Witton
I think a lot.
A Peschanski
Because men don't want to be dads either.
Gabby Edlin
This is what, my what my friends who, who have just given birth and you know, are all like, I don't want to take the pill again. And it's like, yeah, their husbands are like, I don't want another baby yet. Yeah, sure, maybe teenage boys aren't gonna take it. Fine. But like there I think there are a lot of adult males who would just be like, yeah, absolutely. I want to either be in a relationship and not have a baby, or I just want to shag around, and be sure that I I'm not going to, you know, end up with any, you know, playschool bills.
Hannah Witton
Yeah, it's really interesting cuz obviously like the history of it is that the the burden of reproduction, like, falls on the person with the womb because the the consequences of a pregnancy like, affects them more. But, and then with hormonal contraception, so it turns out it's easier to stop one egg, or one or two eggs, releasing a month than it is, it's much harder to stop like 200 million sperm releasing any minute of every day.
Katie Beales
I mean women are fertile what, two days a month, men are fertile like every single day.
Hannah Witton
Yeah, all of the time. Yeah, there's there's a lot of things that are like in development, but it could be years until we see them. There's like a gel that you can rub on your arms, there's another gel that you that's like a temporary vasectomy. So it injects into the tubes, it creates the gel kind of like creates a blockage and then you have another injection to dissolve it and then it will all like flow again.
Gabby Edlin
But this is the thing, I feel like it's just there's no urgency for it because like you know women, and people with wombs, have taken responsibility for it for so long. And like you say, the onus is on the female body so of course, we're going to carry on.
Hannah Witton
Yeah.
Gabby Edlin
Like it is always going to be more harmful for us to not. But still, oh my god, like they've put people on the moon.
Hannah Witton
That's difficult.
Gabby Edlin
Yeah.
Hannah Witton
Now lets stop 200 million sperm.
Gabby Edlin
Yeah.
Hannah Witton
We can do this. I don't even know if it's 200 million. It's a lot.
Gabby Edlin
It's a lot
A Peschanski
But I think it's possible.
Hannah Witton
Yeah, it's only in a small space as well. Like, blockade them.
Gabby Edlin
Yeah.
Hannah Witton
With the spring break.
Gabby Edlin
They need a spring. Oh my god. Can you imagine?
Hannah Witton
I thought I wanted to to end this on, when it comes to periods and contraception, what are you grateful for? What is the, what is the thing you're most grateful for? And what is the thing that you're most frustrated about?
A Peschanski
Planned Parenthood, very grateful for Planned Parenthood.
Hannah Witton
Yeah, or just any kind of service
A Peschanski
Just any service like that, because it's free. They don't even, like in France, I don't know here, but like, they don't take your name.
Hannah Witton
Really?
A Peschanski
They, like if you don't want to give your name, they don't take your name. It's not in your medical record, It's not in anything, and it is like super safe. They have like actual doctors who do all the tests that you need, for free, until you're 18. After that, I don't know.
Hannah Witton
Yeah, I think to counteract that, the thing I'm frustrated about is the lack of funding and the closing down of all of these sexual health services. So but I'm so grateful for them and like why -
Gabby Edlin
I'm so grateful for the sudden like, there's one in Archway that I went to -
Hannah Witton
I think I went to that one
Gabby Edlin
It's a lovely one. They have round seats that twizzle round, everyone's really great there, and they will make you feel you know, completely not judged, and welcome, and you just get yourself sorted out. But yet, the appointments are so hard to come by because it's so underfunded, and it's so frustrating. Yeah, it's so essential.
Hannah Witton
Yeah, definitely. What about in terms of like your body, your periods, that you're grateful for.
Gabby Edlin
I am grateful for the way that my body can feel like at certain points in the month, and I'm like, God, that's just science, like, all this energy is just coming up and this I feel so capable, and there's so much I can do. And then there's other times where I just feel like, you know, my body is saying to me, slow down, and that I feel really grateful to be in a society, in a situation, that I'm lucky enough that I can listen to that. I can, you know, work with my body rather than feel like I'm constantly having to not, like I'm like I'm constantly like, I don't have to keep managing my sort of female body out of existence, if that makes sense.
Hannah Witton
Yeah, yeah.
Katie Beales
Well, I'm grateful for, I'm grateful that contraceptives are free in this country. I think that's brilliant. I have friends who live elsewhere, and they're expensive.
Hannah Witton
Oh, yeah.
Katie Beales
So I think it's amazing that they're free. And what I hate, gosh, I hate that I've had a period, and have endometriosis, I guess.
Hannah Witton
Yeah.
Katie Beales
But then the way there's a positive to that because I've learned so much about my body, about other people's bodies, and I've been able to use it as a platform to do good.
Hannah Witton
Yeah.
Katie Beales
So yeah.
Hannah Witton
Silver linings
Gabby Edlin
Yeah, wish you didn't have to have done that. That you would have learned it all before.
Katie Beales
Yeah. But yeah, but it's happened and then great. Yeah.
Hannah Witton
Well, thank you all so much for sharing your experiences and chatting away. It's been really lovely.
A Peschanski
Thank you
Gabby Edlin
Thank you
Katie Beales
Thank you
Hannah Witton
Thank you so much for listening to Doing It. If you enjoyed it, I would really appreciate it if you left a rating and a review. You can find show notes at DoingItPodcast.co.uk and do go follow us on social media and I'll catch you in the next episode. Bye.
Hannah Witton
This was a global original podcast.