Sex Parties & First Orgasms with Ruby Rare | Transcript
Find the episode shownotes here!
Ruby Rare
An orgasm has to kind of be in your peripheral vision. If you look straight at it, it's gonna like scuttle away, like a scared, little woodland creature.
Hannah Witton
Don't make eye contact
Ruby Rare
Yes, do not make eye contact with your orgasm.
Hannah Witton
Welcome to Doing It with me, Hannah Witton, where we talk all things, sex, relationships, dating, and our bodies. Hi everyone, welcome back to Doing It. This is it, we have made it to the end of season one. And what a great round number to end it on, 29. 29 episodes, maybe one of the longest running seasons of a podcast ever. I just don't know when to stop. However, Christmas, and Hanukkah, and the new year, that is what is making me stop now. But is it really, because next week, there will still be episodes of Doing It, coming into your podcast feed. These are going to be really fun, interesting, weird potentially, minisodes. And on that note, the minisode for next week is actually going to be a Q&A all about season one, all about the podcast. So if you head over to our social media, @DoingItPodcast, on Twitter, and on Instagram, that is where you can ask your questions. You can ask about topics we've covered, you can ask about guests, you can ask about running a podcast, like anything that you want. It can be sex and relationships based, or it can be a podcast based question. And then in an episode that will be coming out next week, not episode, minisode coming out next week, I will answer all of your questions. So make sure to head over to our social media if you have any questions.
Hannah Witton
And also don't forget to review and rate the podcast over on iTunes. It really does help. And season two will be back in January. And now, last but certainly not least, today's guest is Ruby Rare. Ruby is a sex educator and illustrator. You may have seen her around on Instagram. She's also a speaker. She's done lots of talks for adults on sex toys, pornography, and pleasure. And she's just started this new event format which she's calling bisexual sharing circles, and she's hoping to do more of them in the new year. So you know, if you're bi, if you're pan, if you're queer, and you fancy meeting fellow queers, then definitely follow Ruby on Instagram, she is really great at fostering a community over there, and hosting real life events. In this episode, we talk a lot about non monogamy and sex parties, which to my vanilla brain is very exciting and interesting. And then we also kind of strip it back and talk about our first orgasms because as it turns out, Ruby and I were both 20/21ish when we had our first orgasm. And we both talk about our different experiences with that, because they were kind of very different experiences. But I think it's just a really important conversation to have because one of the similarities in our experiences is that we both felt a bit broken because we couldn't have orgasms. And we chat about what led to that actually happening in the end. So you're welcome. Seriously, thank you so much to everyone who has listened to this podcast over season one and I can't wait to just plough on and continue going, we have some cracking guests for season two and I can't wait to share those all with you. But I just want to say Happy Holidays, Merry Christmas, Happy Hanukkah, Happy New Year, all of that good stuff. It's December now so we can totally say those things. Thanks so much for listening and I hope you enjoy this episode.
Hannah Witton
Ruby, thank you so much for having me in your home
Ruby Rare
You're so welcome
Hannah Witton
And for coming on the podcast. You're like a Instagram sex ed legend.
Ruby Rare
I mean, I would love to be described as that all the time, I'm taking it.
Hannah Witton
That's what I think you are!
Ruby Rare
Aw, thank you.
Hannah Witton
I only, well cause we met like ages ago, but I didn't remember that which is really bad of me because I should have, you have pink hair.
Ruby Rare
I don't think I had pink hair then, I had a different coloured hair, but also that was a weird evening and I'm kind of glad when you didn't remember it because there was a lot of there was a lot of stuff going on. I, after we met that evening I had the most blazing row with my partner at the time. After - not because of you, don't worry.
Hannah Witton
What did I do?
Ruby Rare
It was the way that he looked at you. No, I'm really not possessive in that way. But yeah, we met a long time ago.
Hannah Witton
Yeah, that was at Smut Slam. And I've had Cameryn on the podcast as well. She is brilliant.
Ruby Rare
Yay! She's amazing.
Hannah Witton
So I've been a judge at Smut Slam. You have been a judge at Smut Slam. Yeah
Ruby Rare
I actually won Smut Slam the first time I went
Hannah Witton
What!
Ruby Rare
That's why I was asked back as a judge.
Hannah Witton
I've come second, like two times, or third. I don't know. I've always like every time I've spoken, I've like been in the top three, but never first.
Ruby Rare
See, I was not expecting to tell a story the night that I went.
Hannah Witton
Oh, me neither.
Ruby Rare
And but it just so happens that like the most perfect thing happened the weekend before. So I told this story in a really organic way, and I'm very, I'm very confident in some areas, especially areas that other people might not be. So around body positivity, around talking about sex, you know, like other things that are our bread and butter. But I am weirdly very insecure about a couple of bits that most people find normal. So I'm very, I feel really insecure about being funny. Like if I'm funny or not, and I'm kind of convinced I'm not funny, and so then whenever people laugh at me, in a laugh with me - not -
Hannah Witton
Yeah.
Ruby Rare
I'm like, I'm so overwhelmed and I'm like, oh my God! So it was really nice because I told this story and it went down so well. Like I kind of had like an organic punch line that everyone found hilarious. So, it was it was a really nice moment for me, it kind of showed me that I am a bit funny sometimes.
Hannah Witton
And and also, I think what the thing with Smut Slam is that it's not about being funny, it's about telling a great story, which might have some funny moments in it. And when you do kind of tell it naturally in a way, cuz that's kind of how I did it as well, it was just like, hey friends, I'm just gonna tell you something that happened to me like because it's not prepared at all. It's a great event. You should go along.
Ruby Rare
It's amazing.
Hannah Witton
So I wanted to get you on the podcast basically because other than our meeting, the weird -
Ruby Rare
Let's say the prehistoric meeting.
Hannah Witton
The prehistoric meeting. Found you on Instagram. And I think my first encounter with like, who you were was when Instagram deleted your account.
Ruby Rare
Yeah.
Hannah Witton
That was because other people that I follow in the sex ed space were like raging about it. And I was like, who is this person? Yeah, what happened?
Ruby Rare
And that wasn't even that long ago, that was -
Hannah Witton
It was this year.
Ruby Rare
Yeah, it was like earlier in this year, in the summer. It was mad. It was at a time when a lot of sex workers accounts were being taken down, and a lot of other kind of body positive, sex positive accounts were taken down and I still haven't got answers for why it happened. But the censorship around Instagram is really scary and really real. I think it's a community that I love and when I got taken down I literally felt a form of grief because it was, it's a community that I love and depend on, and suddenly loads of people, loads of my friends who I like speak to 99% of the time through Instagram, I suddenly didn't have access to what was going on on there. It just it felt really hard. It felt really hard but a space that you can be so vulnerable in was punishing me
Hannah Witton
Yeah.
Ruby Rare
That was not a very well structured scentence, it just - it was such - I was overwhelmed by how emotional I felt about the whole thing. And then overwhelmed by how much support I got in getting like pushing to get my account back, because I got my back in like two or three days I think, and that was amazing and it was because of the volume of like all the people shouting and reporting it so yeah, I got that back.
Hannah Witton
But you still haven't had any answers as to why in the first place, other than you can assume it was because -
Ruby Rare
Community guidelines.
Hannah Witton
Yeah.
Ruby Rare
But I still don't know if it got taken down because people reporting it, or because bots notice that I that I was kind of -
Hannah Witton
Semi nude.
Ruby Rare
Posting pictures where I was semi nude. I was very good. I never, I didn't break the community guidelines. No nipples. No but cracks. No pubes.
Hannah Witton
Yeah.
Ruby Rare
Just a lot of happy, naked, flesh.
Hannah Witton
There's a lot of double standards within the community guidelines of like, you know, if you're a skinny white woman in a bikini you can show as much as you like, but then any other kind of -
Ruby Rare
But also, I'm so not that far from being a skinny white lady in a bikini. Like I'm mostly white, I'm quite - my body's very average. I'm just showing it in a different way.
Hannah Witton
Yeah.
Ruby Rare
To, kind of, the insta model expectations. And that's where people have an issue. Like suddenly, having body hair like that's a visible thing that people can get offended by. I don't know. I was, this is the second time that I've been censored on a platform that I cared deeply about. The first time was when I was taken off Tinder.
Hannah Witton
What? I didn't realise people can be taken off Tinder
Ruby Rare
Yep, I'm still banned from Tinder.
Hannah Witton
Wait, what? I didn't even know this was possible. Like how, why, what?
Ruby Rare
It is. And I feel so, first of all, I feel really sad about this because I'm amazing at Tinder.
Hannah Witton
I'm sure you are.
Ruby Rare
I'm so, I'm like I am what Tinder wants.
Hannah Witton
Yeah, Tinder need you.
Ruby Rare
Yeah. Because I'm like quite a slutty woman, who likes to have sex with people of all genders, and a super up for having like fun, nice, casual, experiences.
Hannah Witton
You're just like, swiping right constantly.
Ruby Rare
Yeah, I am really what they need. So last year, me and my partner went to New York. And when we like we just got settled in our hotel, we went for a drink, and then both of us were like, oh, let's change our photos on Tinder. So it's photos of both of us, because we were there for a week, if we were going to meet anyone, it wasn't like, I was not going to go off and go and have a date separately, like we were going to date together. So we were both choosing photos. And I put this really, really beautiful photograph that I love, it makes me so happy. Me and my partner and a friend of ours had got really silly and had a bleaching party where we drank too much wine and we all decided to bleach our pubes and our armpit hair.
Hannah Witton
No!
Ruby Rare
And then we had enough bleach at the end left over, and we bleached Alex, my partner's hair, for the first time. And when I was dying at purple, there's this really nice photograph where I'm like, bending down and dyeing their hair. And we're both like looking up and smiling at each other, and it's really cute. And I'm topless, and I put like emojis on my nipples, I was about say nipples on my emojis
Hannah Witton
There should be that.
Ruby Rare
I would love.
Hannah Witton
What do you use as an emoji for boobs? Because I just tend to use two of their like tarts or flans. That's what I use.
Ruby Rare
That's good. I like the two melons, I think but that's a kind of an obvious one. Or two balloons.
Hannah Witton
Yeah.
Ruby Rare
You know those red balloons, I think they're quite nice. So yeah, I put that photo as one of them. And, not joking, within five minutes of putting that as one of my photos on Tinder, someone had reported me and my Tinder had got taken down immediately. And my phone numbers blocked from it, my Facebook's blocked from it. Like there is no way of me getting back on Tinder.
Hannah Witton
Oh.
Ruby Rare
And it's, and that's such a shame because it's not about nudity then, because there are loads of people who post bikini pics, which have a lot more skin showing in them than what I was showing. But I think it was also the fact that we were there as a couple and -
Hannah Witton
But there's lots of couples on Tinder, isn't there?
Ruby Rare
I know, but I think, I don't know, it was also in the states and maybe people have a different reaction to it then. But I think, I think both of those things combined was enough for it to get reported and taken down. At some point I'm gonna get my revenge and I'm going to get back on there.
Hannah Witton
You will. What dating apps do you do use now instead then?
Ruby Rare
I use OkCupid. And I think that's that's pretty much all I use right now. Every time there's a new app that comes on the market, I try it out because I just want to see what's going on with it. But OkCupid is generally what I've settled with. It's it's a nice community of people, there's a lot of if I had more time on my hands I'd be super down for dating people who are new to non monogamy or yeah, haven't kind of, have a lot more learning.
Hannah Witton
Okay, right.
Ruby Rare
How to navigate the world and the scene, but because my time is quite short right now, it's really nice to go -
Hannah Witton
You're like, we need to be on the same page.
Ruby Rare
I'm like, you know all this stuff. Great. Let's just have fun now.
Hannah Witton
So how does your non monogamy like, work? Like you have your partner Alex, but you identify as non monogamous. So for you and your relationship, like how does that work? And like how did you come to realise that that was the kind of relationship that you wanted?
Ruby Rare
Yeah. Well, the first thing I'll say is it works really well.
Hannah Witton
Yeah.
Ruby Rare
It's really nice. Often, when you get questions about non monogamy or polyamory, there's the assumption that like, it's a real struggle, or that like it can, it can be really difficult and it can definitely be difficult at times. But I have found a way that it works for me, that's just like, really easy and nice. And this is my this is my version of normal.
Hannah Witton
Yeah.
Ruby Rare
The first couple of years of being non monogamous in whatever way, can be quite unsettling and a lot of things are unearthed, and you might have realisations that you weren't expecting to have. The people around you, if it's new to them as well, you're having to kind of educate them and get them behind it. I think I became polyamorous and vegan in the same year, because I'm a stereotype.
Hannah Witton
Love it
Ruby Rare
I think you kind of have to do both at the same time.
Hannah Witton
Get kicked out the club, otherwise.
Ruby Rare
You don't get kicked out, but you get looked, it's frowned upon to be only one of them.
Hannah Witton
Okay. Yeah.
Ruby Rare
So I had my friends and my family kind of grappling, if that's the right word to use, with both of these things. And what was funny is that my friends were like vegan, yep, cool, whatever, loads of us are already. That's fine. Polyamory? Crazy. And my parents kind of got behind the polyamory thing really, really quickly.
Hannah Witton
But the vegan vegan thing -
Ruby Rare
But the vegan thing, like a year and a half of like a lot of pushback on that.
Hannah Witton
I love that.
Ruby Rare
So, so yeah, I did kind of very textbook polyamory for a while. I read all the books you were meant to read. I read The Ethical Slut, like More Than Two, all of them. I listened to the podcasts, and I kind of did everything that the advice was telling me to do, which was really good advice. But I was doing it without thinking really.
Hannah Witton
What was the advice? What is textbook polyamory?
Ruby Rare
I think it's, I think it's like having having agreements with a partner that are kind of really explicit. So almost, when I was writing them with partners, we joke and it would almost be like, the 10 commandments of our relationship. And I think the reality for me is that a lot of the time things are a little bit more fluid and flexible than that, and to have this kind of rigid thing. Often I think the danger is, when people move from being in monogamous relationships to non monogamous relationships, they can kind of build a fortress that's really restrictive about what non monogamy means for them. And actually non monogamy is not just one thing, it's so many different things, and you could expect for your relationship styles to keep evolving as you are living, and loving, and fucking.
Hannah Witton
So it might not work for you to like write down an agreement of that agreement to still be the case a month later, six months later.
Ruby Rare
Yeah. And it's also the managing expectations, because if you say well that's not going to happen and then you know, a year down the line that is happening, you've sort of been given this promise early on that it wasn't going to. Whereas if you don't have that promise, if you kind of have some other forms of like agreements, and the trust in relationships is obviously really really important to have before you explore any of this. Non monogamy will not fix a broken relationship.
Hannah Witton
No. Er, no.
Ruby Rare
And also, I guess this is a little bit of an unpopular opinion, it's if you are in a monogamous relationship and you choose to change that relationship style to something that is non monogamous, what whichever way that might be, that can work but from my own personal experience and my friends as well, we all started non monogamy or polyamory in a monogamous relationship, and at some point that relationship actually wasn't working and so you kind of do that as a trial run and then -
Hannah Witton
You spend some solo time being -
Ruby Rare
Then you spend some solo time, and then which has happened now with my this current relationship, I met my partner and we started off in a non monogamous context from the very beginning and I think that works really well.
Hannah Witton
Were they already non monogamous?
Ruby Rare
Yeah.
Hannah Witton
Okay.
Ruby Rare
So and you know, I'm also lucky that both of us were really looking for a very similar type of non monogamy, that was great because I think I've got some trust issues, of just from kind of how things have happened in the past where I do want to feel really secure with one person right now.
Hannah Witton
Yeah.
Ruby Rare
That will change, I'd love to be in a throuple, I've done it before, it's so nice kind of having -
Hannah Witton
Is it like statistically though, finding three people who all fancy each other -
Ruby Rare
Yep. That's hard.
Hannah Witton
Tricky. It's hard enough to find just two people who like each other
Ruby Rare
Yeah, I think the stars, for so many of these things the stars have to align, and they don't very often so. A lot of people presume that being non monogamous, being in a throuple, having a threesome, going to a sex party, that someone who is doing any of those things, they're just going to be like doing them all the time. And they're going to be amazing, and like they have this really juicy, crazy, sordid, sex life. And the reality is, it's a lot more mundane than that. It's you know, there's a lot of emotional admin to do. There's a lot of physical admin to do.
Hannah Witton
Do you have shared calendars?
Ruby Rare
I do have shared calendars. Yeah.
Hannah Witton
I love it.
Ruby Rare
I mean, you're like, admin queen. You're like, sign me up.
Hannah Witton
I'm trying to get my one partner to share a calendar with me and I'm not having the best of times with that. I'm like, please.
Ruby Rare
Yeah, it's it's nice. And you kind of you find you find the rhythm, you find your groove. But what's so lovely is that after doing this for a number of years, it is my normal.
Hannah Witton
Yeah.
Ruby Rare
It's not i'm not living this like crazy life. It might be a little bit like out of the ordinary for some people, but this is just the way that I live. And yeah, like, quite nice, I'm quite happy.
Hannah Witton
Love that. And you mentioned sex parties.
Ruby Rare
I did mention sex parties.
Hannah Witton
Please tell me about sex parties.
Ruby Rare
What would you like to know about sex parties?
Hannah Witton
Erm, well, before we started recording, you kind of said a similar thing about how actually they're quite mundane.
Ruby Rare
Yep. So I, well, they're mundane, and they're surreal, and they're lovely. They're just, I guess the first thing I'd say about sex parties is it's not what you think it is, most of the time. It's not what you have in your mind. It's not the kind of very, some people have this kind of fantasy about sex parties almost being like a well choreographed dance routine amongst many people.
Hannah Witton
Everyone came prepared. Did you learn your lines?
Ruby Rare
Did you warm up?
Hannah Witton
Did you learn the moves? Oh, my God.
Ruby Rare
Camera over here. No, it's it's quite uncoordinated a lot of the time, and it's silly, and joyous, and there's actually a lot less sex at sex parties than you think there is. There's still a lot -
Hannah Witton
Shock horror.
Ruby Rare
But maybe not. It's not kind of like Roman orgy levels at all times.
Hannah Witton
If only!
Ruby Rare
I mean, that's also very nice when that happens. But the best, my favourite memory from a sex party was one my friends hosted one last year, just before Christmas. So it was like our friendship groups Christmas party, and we all went over, I'd say up until like 11 o'clock, it was a very normal -
Hannah Witton
Just a normal party
Ruby Rare
In inverted commas, very normal party. I will say that the spread was incredible. The food at sex parties can be really really top notch. So we all, we all brought dishes. My mate is such a good cook and she had this like amazing dhal, and this really good rice dish. And we had all of that laid out on a table and then we were all sat around drinking, chatting, we hadn't, some of us haven't seen each other in ages. And then we did a silly, someone wrapped themselves up and we did a human pass the parcel.
Hannah Witton
What did they wrap themselves up in? Wrapping paper?
Ruby Rare
Wrapping paper, yeah. And then you did, you took a layer off and then there was like a dare or like and there was some sweets and stuff in there. And then it kind of descended into lovely sexy shenanigans.
Hannah Witton
Yeah.
Ruby Rare
And was already lovely. But then cut to, maybe three in the morning, I turned around to my friend and was like, I'm, I'm really hungry. And I think I'm gonna go for round two of food, is that okay?
Hannah Witton
Was the spread still there?
Ruby Rare
The spread was still there. And so I went, got myself another plate of food, bigger than the one before. I had so many meals at that evening. And I sat myself in the corner, and I was eating this lovely food, and just watching as loads of my friends were having a really nice, sexy time. And I was just in the corner and then after a while they realised
Hannah Witton
That you were just like watching.
Ruby Rare
And everyone started to kind of wave at me, and try and freak me out while I was finishing my food. Yeah, and then and then we had to kind of, I washed up my plates and like started to do a bit of cleaning up at three in the morning, because I was like, you know, everyone else is busy. I think I'll just like, I want to I want to be a good houseguest. And two of my friends were having this really sexy kind of sexual tensiony thing happening when they weren't having sex, but there was a lot of teasing and nice stuff. But like, literally next to me, by their sink, because they've got an open plan kitchen and living room. So again, I had to keep being like oh, yep, don't mind me. I just want to I just want to grab a tea towel. Yep, that's fine. And -
Hannah Witton
That's someone's kink, though.
Ruby Rare
Yeah, totally. And you know, there were also some amazing, lovely sexy things that happened that evening. But that, that's the memory that I've taken away from that night.
Hannah Witton
Oh, I love that.
Ruby Rare
Yeah.
Hannah Witton
How does it work in terms of like, managing those expectations of like, okay, friends come over, we're gonna have a sex party. But then for the first few hours, there is no sex, and then like, but that's fine. But I guess like, if it's your first time going to a sex party, you might be like, who makes the first move? Or like when is, when are things gonna like kick off? Like, what is normal? Do you know what I mean? Like, I feel like that's a thought process that a lot of people would have
Ruby Rare
Absolutely. The first couple of sex parties I went to I did not have sex. Or I think I like made out with someone and was like, okay, I'm going, bye! And some playspaces have a have a rule where the, there's like a "normal", in inverted commas, I don't normally like the word normal, and I'm saying it all the time. It's one of those days
Hannah Witton
Erm, vanilla? But is that any better?
Ruby Rare
No, not even vanilla. Just like a standard party where there's like no sex going on, they'll be like one room that's just like a party -
Hannah Witton
And no sex party.
Ruby Rare
Yeah, and then another space where there will be sex happening. But for some parties, you can't really linger in there. Like if you're gonna have sex in that room, go in there and have sex in that room, but you can't really hover. Because I guess people don't like, that could be a bit creepy, that could be off putting. But the trouble with me, if I was like, wanting to get involved is I'd sort of hover for a little while and then go, oh, no, I can't be here. But they'll, it's awkward, I can't sort of try and just be on the like on the edges of this, like fun, sexy stuff. So having, reducing your expectations as much as possible is great. Because you don't know what's going to happen. It's like any night out. Like it might end up being the craziest night of your life and you like go from after party to after party, and all this lovely funny stuff happens. You might get to a point where you're like, I'm actually really bored. Or I'm at a sex party, and I'm just not turned on.
Hannah Witton
Yeah, or like, I don't fancy anyone here.
Ruby Rare
Yeah, yeah, and that's okay. So it is nice to go with people that you know. Because if you're there with a group of friends, who you have been sexy with in the past, then you kind of -
Hannah Witton
And can feel safe as well, because they're people that you know.
Ruby Rare
Yeah. And the thing that's nice is that when you get into a scene like this, generally, you will know people, like if you keep going to the same sort of party, by the third or fourth one, there will be lots of people that you recognise. And so again, it's not that feeling of like -
Hannah Witton
You're like, oh, I've had sexy time with you, or had sexy time with you.
Ruby Rare
Or you can't remember.
Hannah Witton
Oh no!
Ruby Rare
I've had, I met someone the other day, out of context of a sex party. And we were chatting, and then halfway through, I was like, have you been to this thing? And he was like, yeah, I've been I've been there before. And I was like, oh, I think we've met there then. And he was like, yeah, I think we have. And we both paused and he was like, we've done more than meet there, haven't we?
Hannah Witton
Oh no!
Ruby Rare
And I was like, yeah, I think we have. And then we kind of just carried on in this nice way, cuz if you're in a mad sex situation, you're not often, like you might end up hooking up with someone and you don't know who they are. You haven't - you've had conversations about the sex you're having, and there's been lots of communication about consent, verbal and nonverbal. But you haven't done the like, hi, my name is Ruby. Oh, hey, great. My name is Gemma. Nice to meet you. Yeah. What do you do for a living? Oh, cool like that, that bit doesn't happen.
Hannah Witton
That didn't happen.
Ruby Rare
Yeah.
Hannah Witton
Oh, I love that. Do you and your partner go to sex parties together? Or is that I think that you do or, like, how does that work within your non monogamous relationship?
Ruby Rare
It's a bit of both. I mean, and also, a lot of the time when we'll go together, we'll be going with other friends of mine, of ours.
Hannah Witton
Yeah.
Ruby Rare
And, again, it's just a nice way to socialise. Like the last couple of times I went to sex parties, I didn't have sex. I just like had a dance, saw my friends who hadn't seen in a while, was with my partner, but was just like, oh, this is fun. Sex is happening over there. Cool. I'm gonna go and do this, then I'm gonna go home.
Hannah Witton
Nice.
Ruby Rare
So yeah.
Hannah Witton
Eat the food?
Ruby Rare
Always eat the food. Go back for seconds, if you would like.
Hannah Witton
I love it. Erm, so this is kind of like the life that you're living now. And also, you're a sex educator.
Ruby Rare
Yeah. And I do, I'm not just always at sex parties.
Hannah Witton
No, you're also cooking vegan food.
Ruby Rare
I'm also cooking a lot of vegan food, so that I can bring that to the sex party. Yeah, that is my life. That's what I do.
Hannah Witton
Dyeing your hair pink. This is what you do. Erm, but one of the things that kind of resonated me when I was looking on your profile, you have like a little about me thing. And one of the things that you'd written in that was, had your first orgasm at 20. And I was like, oh my God, same. And I think I was 21 ish. I was in my second year of uni. And -
Ruby Rare
Me too.
Hannah Witton
Ah, and so I just wanted to talk about that because I'm like, Oh, my God, same.
Ruby Rare
We're orgasm twins!
Hannah Witton
Orgasm twins! But like, what, what was that whole thing for you like? Because I, it was a whole thing for me. I just remember it being a whole thing.
Ruby Rare
But we were talking just before we recorded, I hadn't realised that you were already making sex education content -
Hannah Witton
Yeah.
Ruby Rare
- then, because that's crazy.
Hannah Witton
I was, yeah, I was talking about sex online. I was making educational content, I was consuming a lot as well. And I 100% felt like a fraud because I knew the theory of how to orgasm, but never done it myself.
Ruby Rare
But also I think we talk about like 20/21 like that's quite late. I think loads of people don't have orgasms, particularly when you have a vulva.
Hannah Witton
Yeah.
Ruby Rare
Until that age or older. And 20/21 is still a baby, like you're still a spring chicken. There's so much to learn, like what both of us are sort of mid-late 20s, I've got so much to learn. And I think the older that I get, the more aware I am that I know nothing.
Hannah Witton
Yeah.
Ruby Rare
So I think looking back now, 20 was the right time for me to have an orgasm for the first time. But I became sexually active when I was 15, and I had five years of just being convinced that everyone was at an orgasm party, and I wasn't invited, and I was never going to go to the orgasm party, and I felt like a fraud, and I had such a variety of experiences. I faked orgasms from the from the moment that I started to have sex because I just presumed that was normal.
Hannah Witton
I never faked an orgasm.
Ruby Rare
Oh, you're like a gold star, instead of gold star lesbian, you're like a gold star orgasmer.
Hannah Witton
I don't know why I decided to never fake it. It was definitely, because I I totally understand the mentality of like, why you would fake an orgasm. Like I can totally understand why people do that. But I literally don't know why I never did, like all of my sexual partners, from being a teenager through university, all new, which was a bit annoying at times because then they'd be like, I have a magic dick, I can do this, or like personal mission.
Ruby Rare
And then it brcomes about them rather than about -
Hannah Witton
Yeah.
Ruby Rare
Because this was, now that I sleep with all genders, it is a lot more diverse. When you're, if I'm, because sometimes I can still find it quite difficult to have an orgasm when I'm starting to sleep with someone. It takes a couple of weeks of getting comfortable and getting to know each other's bodies before that's something that I can do really easily. And now everyone is really understanding of that. But there was definitely a time when I was sleeping with women, and with non binary people, and they were like super accommodating to it. And I was still sleeping with some men who were like, well, this is about me. This is a personal attack that my, like magical dick, and tongue, and fingers, cannot make you have an orgasm, and it's really got nothing to do with them.
Hannah Witton
No.
Ruby Rare
It's it's such a nice revelation. And I cannot remember where I heard this first, but someone told me is such it's you know, sometimes they're like those real epiphany moments. It's so simple. But the notion that no one can make you have an orgasm. You make yourself orgasm.
Hannah Witton
Yeah.
Ruby Rare
You give yourself an orgasm. And if someone, or many other people, are there, helping or just witnessing -
Hannah Witton
Helping along the way
Ruby Rare
It's a gift to them. They're just like, they're just a helping hand. Sometimes quite literally. Not the reason why it's happening. And I think for a long time, I just presumed that I, it was up to someone else.
Hannah Witton
I like that, I've not heard that before. And I like that. An epiphany that I had from Emily Nagoski’s book was that your biggest sexual organ is your brain. Which I loved because I was like, that makes so much sense to me. Like, yes, my brain has to be like so on board for anything.
Ruby Rare
Well, again, the stars have to align.
Hannah Witton
Yeah.
Ruby Rare
And like, you know, there are ways of getting better at making the stars align, but they still have to align. Like if something is, if I'm thinking about something else, or I'm unfocused or like I'm having a wobbly mental health week, having an orgasm is not going to be the same as the moments when I'm kind of like feeling in a really good place.
Hannah Witton
Yeah.
Ruby Rare
I love the accelerator from Emily Nagoski’s book. Oh, gosh. Again, I know I've showed that to so many friends.
Hannah Witton
Same!
Ruby Rare
Who are like, it makes sense. Oh my gosh, I'm not broken.
Hannah Witton
Oh, my God, same, Anytime friends of mine are like, oh, a friend, a friend of mine recently was this like, I have a friend?
Ruby Rare
And that friend is me.
Hannah Witton
Yeah. And I was like, just read this book. Like it has anything to do with like mismatched sex drives, it helps a tonne. And that's like one of the most like common problems that people might have. For your first orgasm then, was that solo? Or was that with a partner? Was it a relief? Were you trying to have an orgasm?
Ruby Rare
I wasn't trying. I think when it comes to orgasms, the harder you try, the less likely it's going to be.
Hannah Witton
100%.
Ruby Rare
Like an orgasm has to kind of be in your peripheral vision. If you look straight at it, it's just gonna like scuttle away. Like a scared little woodland creature.
Hannah Witton
Don't make eye contact.
Ruby Rare
No, do not make eye contact with your orgasm. That's like straight out of Big Mouth.
Hannah Witton
Oh my God. Yeah,
Ruby Rare
I want to see how they depiction an orgasm as a character. Anyway, totally off track.
Hannah Witton
Yeah, I'd love to see that.
Ruby Rare
I was with a partner. And it was, it's weird because I was sleeping with, up until that point, people who didn't really see my pleasure as something that was an important component to the sex we were having. And so this was the first person where they were like, oh, no, I want you to have a nice time. And for me, that was just a fucking revelation, which clearly says a lot about my taste in men from the ages of 15 to 20.
Hannah Witton
Yeah.
Ruby Rare
But, so this was someone who was like really invested in me having a nice time, but not putting pressure on me to have an orgasm. And rather than it being that kind of goal of like, right, this is what we're going to do. Let's go. We just took like, for weeks, we just took it really slow and like figured out what was working, and what wasn't. And I had an orgasm, grinding on top of him, not having penetrative sex, just like lovely grinding stuff.
Hannah Witton
Amazing.
Ruby Rare
And it felt really, really nice that the critical person inside me, the like critical side of my brain, was not convinced that it was an orgasm for a really long time.
Hannah Witton
Oh, how come?
Ruby Rare
And I was like, I think that was an orgasm, but maybe it wasn't, I don't know. Because well we get the depiction from like Hollywood, everywhere, that an orgasm is this like huge, screaming, like the When Harry Met Sally kind of thing
Hannah Witton
Yeah. Did it take you having more orgasms that felt the same to be like, okay, no, that definitely was one as well.
Ruby Rare
Yeah, yeah. And then you know, the more the more experiences you have, the more you can get a picture of like the nuances and the differences because you don't just have one kind of orgasm. There are like loads and loads of different types.
Hannah Witton
Yeah.
Ruby Rare
And there was someone who I was speaking to the other day who was really surprised by me saying this. I kind of, it's obvious when you think about it. The path of having an orgasm is very, very similar to when you have like a massive cry, or a massive laugh.
Hannah Witton
Yeah
Ruby Rare
You know how there's like you're laughing and laughing laughing till it's like hurting, and then you get this peak thing, and then at the end you go like, ahhh.
Hannah Witton
Ahhh.
Ruby Rare
And that's the same as a big cry or a big orgasm.
Hannah Witton
One of the things that I've recently realised that having an orgasm is like, is morphine. Because when I was in -
Ruby Rare
You've had a fun life
Hannah Witton
When I was hospital, so not fun, but the morphine that I was on, just that kind of like really weird, drowsy feeling that it would give you and you're like, huh. Sometimes if I can't sleep, I will masturbate and have an orgasm, and that will like, send me into that similar like, morphine state of like -
Ruby Rare
Yeah.
Hannah Witton
And now I'm sleeping. And it's so weird how those two feelings, or at least I kind of weirdly associate them as quite similar.
Ruby Rare
Yeah. And I guess in your mind, you've associated both of them with comfort to some extent. Yeah, like morphine in the context of -
Hannah Witton
Morphine in the context of pain,
Ruby Rare
Really full on surgeries. Welcome.
Hannah Witton
Yeah, like thank you. Oh, now I'm going to melt into the bed.
Ruby Rare
Yes.
Hannah Witton
Yeah, that's, that's really interesting. My first orgasm was solo.
Ruby Rare
Oh, nice, I'm kind of jealous about that. I would love that to be the case. Tell me about yours.
Hannah Witton
Um, it was, I remember just feeling like a failure at this point. Like, I genuinely thought that I was one of those people that never could. And but because I was a sex educator, I also like had in my head, but it's fine, and that's also normal. And you know, you're not a failure, and like, pleasure isn't always about orgasm. And I had like, the sex educator voice in my head. But then I also had the like, me voice in my head, which is like, I just really want to have an orgasm. I just really want to be able to do that. That would be great, thanks. And I'd had lots of pleasurable sex, some not so great sex, but I what I did find pleasure in it. And yeah, I just remember like, when I was younger, not really understanding what masturbation was like, I thought it was literally fingering yourself.
Ruby Rare
Yeah.
Hannah Witton
Which never worked for me. And I was just like, why is this not working? I don't understand. And then I think I had the house to myself, one day, and I put on some porn. Did I get a vibrator out? Yeah, I had a bullet vibrator, as well.
Ruby Rare
One of those classic five pound Ann Summers.
Hannah Witton
Basically, yeah
Ruby Rare
We've all been there.
Hannah Witton
And, yeah, and basically just like bullet vibrator, porn, and I was just like, I'm just going to watch some porn and just enjoy myself. And I literally, it was the same thing, like no pressure on myself to come at all. It was just like, I'm just gonna have a good time. And then it happened. And I was like, what, and I called the guy I was seeing at the time, and I was like, I think I just had my first orgasm, and he didn't really seem to care.
Ruby Rare
I, my partner did care. But then I went, then the next day, I was like, in the kitchen with two of the women that I was living with. And I was like, I think I had an orgasm yesterday. And both of them were like, oh my God! I think someone went out and got drinks. It's so nice, how your friends can be that invested in your sex life and your pleasure.
Hannah Witton
I love that.
Ruby Rare
It's very important.
Hannah Witton
I'm here for all of my friends' orgasms.
Ruby Rare
Oh yeah
Hannah Witton
Not physically here, in terms of like in the room with them. But here spiritually, and just like -
Ruby Rare
I know, a group of really amazing women. And I'm, maybe this will be the good time to let them know that I want to be in this gang. It has been brought to my attention that they have a Whatsapp group, where they, which is just solely designed for talking about wanking.
Hannah Witton
Yes.
Ruby Rare
And they will leave each other voice notes after they've had a wank. Like a Yelp review for their solo sex.
Hannah Witton
This one was a seven out of 10. Feeling great.
Ruby Rare
It makes me so happy. But I don't know them well enough to be immediately in the gang.
Hannah Witton
You're like, how do I get an invite?
Ruby Rare
And I don't think, I don't I think you can ask to be invited to something like that. I think that the invite has to come naturally. Or maybe you just talk about it on a podcast and you hope that they listen to it and they invite you on to it.
Hannah Witton
Yeah. Are you listening, people with the wank whatsapp group?
Ruby Rare
The wank gang.
Hannah Witton
The wank gang, oh my God, I love it. Yeah, since I'm like, being orgasmic, I've really enjoyed talking about wanking with with friends. And I feel like talking about it has been, has enabled me to learn other things about my own body, as well that I didn't know was possible because someone would be like, Oh, I do this, or like this kind of thing works me, and I'm like, oh, and then the next thing you know, I'm trying it and I'm like, what the?
Ruby Rare
Yeah, well, that's like, Oh My God, Yes.
Hannah Witton
Yeah.
Ruby Rare
That was - that was so lovely, because, yeah, it gave me loads of tips that I hadn't even thought about.
Hannah Witton
Yeah, exactly. I need to get on watching season two.
Ruby Rare
Yeah. I've not watched any of season two yet.
Hannah Witton
Because that one I'm interested in because I tend, because season two is. Well Season One is, like external, so it's mostly clitoral stimulation for listeners who don't know OMG Yes. It's amazing. And then Season Two that they've recently released is internal stimulation, because -
Ruby Rare
I think I need some homework on -
Hannah Witton
Yeah, I'm just like, you know, nothing wrong with broadening your horizons when it comes to masturbation, so I'm intrigued.
Ruby Rare
Yeah, and even though, like you and I both talk about sex all the time, and we talk to other people about the sex that they're having, and I'm really happy with the sex that I have and with like the solo and partner sex that I have. But it's just really nice to remind yourself that you can always do a bit more. There's always a bit more homework to do, there is always like something different that you can try out.
Hannah Witton
Yeah, I'm huge fan of self improvement across the board.
Ruby Rare
Yeah.
Hannah Witton
In like all areas of life and sex is definitely like one of them. Sex isn't, you know, that is included under the self improvement.
Ruby Rare
Yeah, that would be nice. I've never - I can squirt. Not that that's important.
Hannah Witton
No.
Ruby Rare
But it's just like a nice string to my bow.
Hannah Witton
Was that something that you practiced doing, that you like wanted to do? Or something that you're just like, oh, this is something I can do.
Ruby Rare
Completely by accident. This started happening two and a half years ago.
Hannah Witton
Yeah.
Ruby Rare
So for the majority of my sex, sexual life, like it has not happened. Like nothing, yeah, no, it just wasn't even something I was thinking about. And then I slept with a couple of people, in quite quick succession, who, who just like knew what they were doing, really?
Hannah Witton
Also, I don't really like the word squirt. Because, for me, I find it's more of, a lot of a dribble.
Ruby Rare
Yes. Oh my gosh, completely!
Hannah Witton
Like, it's not a squirt.
Ruby Rare
What you see any porn is not the reality for most people.
Hannah Witton
Yeah. It's just like, oh, and there's a gush of liquid.
Ruby Rare
And a lot of the time, that's also really inconvenient. Because I now have to wash my sheets all of the time.
Hannah Witton
Oh, yeah. When I, so I didn't know what it was at the time. But like retrospectively, I'm like, oh, I was like squirting all the time when I was 15. Like, and it's so weird, because I can't even do it that same way anymore.
Ruby Rare
Can you make - squirt such an annoying word, but and you can use squirt when you're just on your own?
Hannah Witton
Literally, it has happened once.
Ruby Rare
Okay.
Hannah Witton
And very recently.
Ruby Rare
Well, congrats.
Hannah Witton
And so it's so weird to me, because I'm like, oh, I was, I want to use inverted commas because it's not squirting. There wasn't like a, whooosh.
Ruby Rare
I was dribbling a lot.
Hannah Witton
Dribbling a lot, out of my vagina, or maybe not even out my vagina. We don't really know where it even comes from.
Ruby Rare
I'm not scrubbed up on squirt stuff. There's amazing women called Lola Jean who is great. And she is the Guinness World Record holder for volume of squirt produced, and she knows a lot.
Hannah Witton
Like logically, I think it comes from the glands that are either side of the vagina.
Ruby Rare
Yeah.
Hannah Witton
That's where I'm like, that's where it comes from.
Ruby Rare
I think, I think some of it can come from the Skene's glands.
Hannah Witton
Yeah.
Ruby Rare
But also some of it, it does come from the bladder. It's not wee.
Hannah Witton
It's not wee, I've licked it, I've smelt it, it's not wee
Ruby Rare
It's absolutely not wee. Let's just say that. But also, if it was wee, how bad would that be?
Hannah Witton
Yeah.
Ruby Rare
Like why would why would that be awful?
Hannah Witton
Also, a lot of the time I feel like I need to pee during sex.
Ruby Rare
Yeah.
Hannah Witton
Just, that's just a thing that happens.
Ruby Rare
Totally normal. But yeah, I can't, I've never squirted on my own. I've only squirted when I've been with a partner, when they've been doing quite a lot of stuff. And I don't think that's because I haven't got like the magic touch. But I think it's because I need to be really relaxed. Like my body, I need to be like, basically completely docile, lying on my back, just like my body moving, in order for that to happen. And if I'm doing something to myself, with a toy, or with my hands, suddenly a part of my body's tensed and I can't do it. So maybe OMGYes Season Two will help me.
Hannah Witton
Yeah, I don't know whether they have squirting stuff on there. We shall we shall see. This has been a fantastic chat.
Ruby Rare
We've jumped around a lot, haven't we.
Hannah Witton
I love it
Ruby Rare
It's been fun.
Hannah Witton
It's been fun. I could talk to you for ages about all these things.
Ruby Rare
Thanks, same.
Hannah Witton
Yeah, definitely go check Ruby out on Instagram. She is amazing. And in the new year, you're going to be doing a lot more of your talks and events and workshops and things. So keep an eye out for all of that. Thank you so much.
Ruby Rare
You're so welcome. Thank you Hannah.
Hannah Witton
Thank you so much for listening to Doing It. If you enjoyed it, I would really appreciate it if you left a rating and a review. You can find show notes at DoingItPodcast.co.uk and do go follow us on social media and I'll catch you in the next episode. Bye
Hannah Witton
This was a Global original podcast.